Peace on Earth! NBA lockout ends, Heat & league to open Christmas; Excited or residual resentment? (with poll)
[See latest results -- the 2011 final season results -- in our Canesfan Satisfaction Meter poll in blogpost directly below this. Also, join us on Twitter @gregcote]
PEACE ON EARTH! HEAT, NBA OPENING CHRISTMAS DAY: Saturday it was announced there was a tentative areement reached to end the four-months-plus NBA lockout, and that if approved as expected a shortened 66-game season would begin on Christmas Day with a tripleheader. Reports are the Heat will be one of the six teams first in play, at Dallas. That's perfect: That the Big 3 Part 2 begin right where the first season ended, in a Finals loss. To whet your appetite, click here for a Very LeBron Thanksgiving, from his Twitter feed. And Click on What Lockout? for today's column by me, online and in the inky-pulp edition.
Wondering if excitement over the season finally starting immediately overwhelms any resentment over the long delay, or whether rancor lingers. Take a dip in our poll and say why.
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NBA? so what. NBA is a 3rd tier pro sport after NFL & MLB giants. Same for the NHL.
Miami Heat have a great chance of winning it all considering their starting line up talent. Lockout may have benefitted the Heat more then any other NBA team. No offseason, shortened regular season. IMO anyone but the Lakers...
Jimbo - most people hate either the MLB or NBA or both but more people watch the NBA than MLB so you can debate which is a better sport or bring up the completely outdated and untrue "America's pastime" thing but the numbers show that the NBA is the more popular of the two and neither one's popularity is in the same ballpark, city, state, country, planet, or galaxy as the NFL.
I thought I was going to have to watch tiddlywinks from jolly old England this winter, but thanks be alive the NBA is back. For a moment there I was having nightmares about actually having to tune in to some sleep inducing college basketball games when the football season ended. Nothing to fear, I can now go back to dreaming that Cote will get off his ass and find the cojones to start an investigative series on Dona Shalala and how she has destroyed the Miami Hurricanes program. Do you do that Cote? Or are you just a tool for the university?
Cote, Jim Murray would written an article about the fiasco that is the University of Miami football program. He would have written about the poor attendance at JRS. About the sea of empty seats at every game. He would have written about the failed negotiations to refurbish the Orange Bowl so that the Hurricanes could play their games close to campus in a remodeled stadium. Murray would have written a column asking why corruption has flourished since she came on board. He would have asked why the University allowed boosters like Shapiro to have access to the program. He would have continued to ask the tough questions wanting to know how a nationally ranked program that has won five national championships since 1983 is now playing to in a 3/4 empty stadium 30 miles northwest of its campus and losing embarrassingly to 14 point underdogs at home. But then Jim Murray, may God rest his soul, was a Pulitzer price winner and you are just a stiff collecting a paycheck and paying some intern to run this blog.
Interesting how quickly deals come together after unions recognize their very existence is threatened and owners are faced with billion dollar lawsuits.
NBA season starting on Christmas Day is still way too long- as are the games themselves. If they only played the final five minutes the games wouldn't seem to go on for so long!
Woodcock - while there is some truth to what you say, there is nothing that can be done about Shalala because the good she has done for the university outweighs even the total destruction of the football team in the eyes of the trustees, of which nearly all the "Regular Members" serve because they initially were just big fans of the team.
Whenever I talk about UM most people say I'm not a real fan or I'm just defending Shalala (for god knows what ulterior reason...) but my Hurricane fanhood really is beyond reproach. Both my parents hold multiple degrees from UM. I hold multiple degrees from UM. Both sides of my family's names are on chaired positions and graduate departmental grants and I sit in the president's box for a game or two every year. My grandfather was an usher at the OB for thirty five years. I went to my first UM game before I was 1 year old. I have traveled to every UM national championship game since 1987. I have been to every Orange Bowl game UM has played in since I've been alive. I have seen UM play at FSU, at Ohio State, at Florida, at Notre Dame, at Oklahoma, and at Virginia Tech.
I tell you that hopefully add some measure of credibility to telling you this - just as there's really no point in my explaining Shalala's situation to UM fans who don't care about the university, there's no point in the media vilifying her to the people who run it. She won't be fired because the football team doesn't win, even if everything was all her fault.
I don't buy all the excuses and explanations that have been offered for why UM hasn't been winning this past decade. Joining the mighty ACC? Seems like a stretch, we're usually competitive with the good teams and still lose to the bad ones. No OB? An incredibly sad and stupid decision but the teams of the '80s could beat anyone anywhere. Anyone who had season tickets knows that the OB was just as empty as Joe Robbie for bad games. Boosters? Are you kidding me? That's how college football works. There were boosters when UM was winning championships in the '80s and there are boosters at EVERY major SEC team right now. Only difference is that UM's booster came from their horrible local fanbase and wasn't an alumni who cared about the university. Even if an Alabama or Florida booster made his money illegally he would NEVER throw his alma mater under the bus when he got caught.
Everyone has an opinion about all the reasons UM hasn't been any good in the past decade, mine is two very bad coaches in a row. Period. I don't think it's any more complicated than that.
I'm hoping beyond hope it's not three in a row but it makes me very nervous the way the entire fanbase (including myself) is fawning over a 6-6 coach. I keep the faith and can't wait to see who Golden brings in for his first full recruiting class.
I will say this though - if UM receives heavy sanctions and the NCAA reveals some angle that could be spun as Shalala's being responsible, a large media backlash could force her to retire, she's over 70 years old anyway.
If there was any time for Cote to step up and make a name for himself it would be in the days following the NCAA's announcement of UM's sanctions.
Maybe start working on that draft now so LeBatard doesn't beat you to it.
Biggest storyline to me is Baron Davis' situation. If Cleveland holds on to him he takes up a huge chunk of their cap and sits behind the #1 pick Kyrie Irving.
If they release him he immediately signs with the Heat for a minimum salary while still collecting the money the Cavs owe him on the year.
So knowing what we know about that owner, is there any chance that fielding a competitive team wins out over spiting LeBron James?
Not bad and well said, Kazaam. Between the lines of what you wrote run the unanswered questions that this community has been itching to learn. My frustration, like that of many Hurricane fans, is that I feel that the media has done almost nothing to seek out the answers to the questions. I use Cote as a vehicle to address the media here because this is his blog and I know that sometimes he actually reads what's been written here. The Miami Herald needs to step up its investigation of the program. It took a Jimmy Olsen type reporter working for Yahoo to bring the Shapiro story to light. At the moment we are in limbo all awaiting what the NCAA will decide but that doesn't mean that the Herald and reporters who work for the paper like Cote should get a free pass. The what, where, who, why, and how, are as important today as they were when Eve convinced Adam to take that bite. What I want are answers to why Shalala and the University made the decisions that ultimately landed this program in the toilet that it's floating in today. A little more investigation and less procrastination please.
Yea, the Herald really is hurting for good writers - Edwin Pope has been sweet and senile for many years now, LeBatard only chimes in with articles about race or hyper analysis of fan-media relations, and Cote has never been one to research anything beyond what he can Google.
I've noticed that the guy that now writes FIU's stories, David Neal, is pretty good as a beat writer but I've never seen anything too groundbreaking or controversial out of him.
The Miami New Times is actually a much better source for investigative journalism, they broke the N**** S***** story way before Yahoo, a great article called "The Caligula of Miami" or something similar.
Might be worth emailing the editor at Miami New Times, they all hate UM because most of them went to FIU and they don't seem to get much feedback, pretty much every time I write them about something dumb Uncle Luke said it makes it into the "Letter to the Editor" column.
really good points, kazaam. my father graduated from the university of miami; i grew up in the orange bowl for both the dolphins and the hurricanes. i believe it falls on coaching as well. coker's awful recruiting really put us back too, with the turnaround the gators experienced and the advent of 2 more programs in the state. i hope to god golden can turn this thing around.
was thinking about that 2001 team and shadow's foggy recollections. that team would have destroyed ANY team fielded by USC in history. in fact, if you could put together an all star USC team throughout history, that miami team would have eaten them alive
it's funny here in los angeles, listening to these cats out here getting all butt hurt about their pac 12, and how the SEC shouldn't have all the attention.
if USC played in the SEC, they MIGHT have won once in the last 10 years..
once in the last ten years? think before you type, please. there wasn't anybody in the SEC better than USC at the end of the 2002 season, the one with UM/OSU for the vase and carson palmer wining the heisman. and according to our beloved michigan grad, jim mandich, RIP, the trojans were playing better than anyone at season's end. destroyed iowa in the orange bowl with troy with the crazy hair riding the bicycle on the sideline the entire game. next year they split the title with the humans voting for uSC and LSU winning the vase. the next year USC crusg=hed oklahoma for the title; one time in ten years, my friend?
Nobody really cares about your life story Kazaam. It's low of you to bash other Hurricane fans and try to belittle them. That's why most on here don't like you. I don't go to Dolphin games and speak in a holier than thou way to other Phin fans. Rather, I like the fact that they are fellow Dolphin fans and I try to enjoy the game ALONG with them. Makes sense. Taking your venom out on people of the same fanbase just makes you look foolish.
To a casual college follower such as myself, USC and UM stand alone as powerhouses within certain periods in time. As we sit here today, I'd say that SC's program is in a far better place than that of Mia. The Canes are reeling, while the Trojans are aroused and exposed.
I give you the 80's. Miami produced double digit great players through that period and they were the undisputed #1 NFL production factory. That being said when one takes a longer view, more importantly, how things are now, any objective eye would say that SC continues the tradition while Mia. is no where i the same discussion. It is what it is.
Last best UM player who distinguished himself in the NFL is who? Try matching that output vs. the slew of linebackers and QB's making a name today.
Make the case that Miami Hurricanes program is set to produce more NFL ready players than SC. Make the case that they have done so for the past 5 years...and I'm being generous. Florida and Florida St. have posted better than the U.
There are easily 5 players from SC who will be picked in the draft ahead of Ray-Ray. What, you're telling me that the U is still a NFL factory? Yeah, right!
Even our second string, like Sam Shields who couldn't break into our lineup at Miami goes to the pros and wins a Superbowl ring as one of the starting corners for the World Champ Green Bay Packers. Jimmy Graham is the top tight end in the NFL and he only played one season at Miami.
The only thing that Trojans are good for is to hold my jizz.
I recorded the FSU v. Fla. game today and I'm sitting here watching it right now. That "has" to be Jacory Harris playing quarterback for the Gaytors tonight. He he he. There's something uplifting about seeing the Gaytors take it up the ass at home. Couldn't have happened to a nicer bunch of guys.
Hey, i sold hot dogs during the 72 season at the Orange Bowl. That don't make me an undefeated concessionary guy. For that matter, I remember that you sitting next to Charles Nelson Reilly over at Chasens, that don't make you partial to wienerschnitzel...ehr...I take that back.
No school can match this group of legends. Miami produces studs at EVERY POSITION. USC can't compete..
QBs:
Jim Kelly (HOF)
Bernie Kosar
Vinny Testaverde (Heisman)
RBs:
Frank Gore (top 5 RB today)
Willis McGahee
Edgerrin James (10,000 rushing yds club)
Clinton Portis (almost at 10,000 yds rushing)
Ottis Anderson (10,000 rushing yds club)
WRs:
Eddie Brown
Michael Irvin (HOF)
Andre Johnson (best WR in NFL today-just injured now)
Leonard Hankerson
Santana Moss
Reggie Wayne (potential for HOF)
Roscoe Parrish
TEs:
Jimmy Graham (best tight end in NFL today)
Kellen Winslow
Greg Olsen
Bubba Franks
Jeremy Shockey
Oline:
Eric Winston
Chris Myers
Jim Otto (HOF)
Leon Searcy
Bryant McKinnie
Dline:
Kenard Lang
Kenny Holmes
Daniel Stubbs
Vince Wilfork (best NT in NFL today)
Jerome Brown
Russ Maryland
Warren Sapp (arguably greatest DT of all time)
Damione Lewis
Dwayne Johnson
LBers:
Jessie Armstead
Darrin Smith
Michael Barrow
Jonathan Vilma
Jon Beason
DJ Williams
Ray Lewis (Greatest LB of all time)
Dan Morgan
Ted Hendricks (HOF)
Rohan Marley
DBs
Phil Buchanon
Sean Taylor
Bennie Blades
Darryl Williams
Bubba McDowell
Antrel Rolle
Sam Shields
Duane Starks
Earl Little
Kenny Phillips
Brandon Meriweather
Ed Reed (Greatest S of all time)
Special Teams
Devin Hester (Greatest KR of all time)
Sick of hearing about USC. They are vastly overrated as professionals. Plenty turn out to be stiffs. Matt Leinart was a big time bust. Reggie Bush has NEVER lived up to the hype-he has small spurts of effectiveness. LenDale White was a disappointment. Carson Palmer has been decent. Mark Sanchez= way overrated. I mean you mention Marcus Allen and OJ...but for really you don't have too much after that. They were fine players, but Miami just puts out a lot more.
No one forced you to read my life story "I am stoned".
I don't care if anyone complains about UM players' performance, I don't even care if anyone asininely sits behind their computer complaining about the effort of kids who are at practice at 6:30 every morning.
But for you to say that Jacory Harris, Travis Benjamin, and Ray Ray Armstrong are a bunch of entitled and illiterate asses who are going to be dealing crack in back alleys, and to honestly think that players like Warren Sapp and Michael Irvin and Ed Reed would agree with you????
I wasn't just popping off, as far as UM football goes, I couldn't be more heartfelt or sincere when I say f*ck you.
Jimbo - I think it was you that brought this up a while back, as a rule I disagree with everything Rick Reily says so no, apparently Aaron Rogers has not already surpassed Brett Favre.
The argument that I am making is not that Miami failed to produce great players, my argument is that they have stopped doing so, whereas SC continues. I'm talking tortoise and the hare, here. SC just keeps plugging along. At the start of this NFL season the list of active ex-Trojans on team rosters totaled 55.
Sacrilege! How dare you soil the pages of this blog with that trojan (The only thing that trojans are good for is to hold my jizz)web site. The very one that banned me for life after 15 minutes. Why you might as well just publish Fidel's website about his revolution's successes on this blog.
S*** it would have been more exciting for NBA to be locked out permanehtly and listen to all B-Ball fans whine and B-Ball players have to move to europe HA HA HA bunch of pussies...
there is no question that USC has sent the most players into the NFL over the years. UM has had a swlew of players, but UM's top five runners are 3-4-5 after oj simpson and marcus allen. michael irvin HOF- so is lynn swann. OL candidae of the canes jim otto- usc has ron mix, bruce matthews, the greatest OLman in history in anthony munoz and tony boselli waiting in the wings. jimmy graham is a nice story, but not close to charles young as a receiver or blocker. DBs? ronnie lott, most people's candidate as greatest DB (meaning all positions, and especially safety. let us make a distinction between pros and college careers to unmuddle the picture- none of the five canes listed as runners were better than ricky bell, RIP, an untacklable combination of 4.4./4.5 speed. 6'3" and 230 pounds. sam cinningham was a better back than every one of the five canes listed but mackay made a blocking fullback out of him, exceppting for four dives over ohio state and woody hayes' prize goal line defense in the 73 rose bowl. some of the UM players listed are bums and fish worth throwing back-BUBBA FRANKS!!!!!KENARD LANG!!!ray lewis greatest LB of all-time? your opinion, but butkus he ain't, nitschke he aint, and wasn't lawrence taylor a LB? most of the UM players listed are good, but not the greatest ever to play at their positions. eric winston is a good player, but is he yary, mix, munoz or even tony boselli? just keep on supplying the candidates from coral gables and we will take a microscopic look at their careers put them on the lower shelves wher they belong in the supermarket of NFL players. no disagreement about ed reed being at the top of today's safety list, but he wouldn't rank above the fabulously talented kenny easly of UCLA/seahawks whose had a very short 5 years but is nose and nose with ronnie lott to the wire for greatest safety ever.
OC - ya, counted from the "Miami Hurricanes in the NFL" wikipedia page.
Shadow - Ray Lewis is the greatest linebacker that has ever played the game.
Go by the numbers. Go by their play. Go by anything other than just deifying players who happened to play in an older generation and you come to that conclusion.
charle young; will go check out the stats on jeremy shockey and kellen winslow, neither of whom could block your mother. charle (tree) young was a TE in the era when the position demanded that the TE be as much a blocker as pass catcher, and he was good at both. kellen winslow the II and jeremy shockey are deinitely on the all-mouth team.
lynn swann played on a primarily running team, and like paul warfield doesn't have eye-popping stats except for yads/catch. swann a;lso had john stallworth on the other side who maddog, RIP, thought was a better passcatcher but not the athlete that swann was. have we forgotten the juggling, didving catched in the SB against dallas that won the game for the steelers?
now, on to the TE comparison:
charle young (clasmate at USC in california history at USC and was six four and 235 i believe: charle in 14 game seasons for most of his careeer methinks: 418 catches, 5,106 yds, 27TDs, and 12.2 yds/catch.
shockey: 534 catches, 5.999 yards, 11.2/catch and 34 TDS
winslow "the warrior": 409 catches, 4549 yds, 11.1yds/catch, 23 TDs.
you decide on what is more, but charle young was eally the first "athletic" TE i believe and was a great guy; shockey and winslow aren't in the most likable division of ball players.
what did your wiikipedia page say about the LB count? doing it long-hand, from 1980-present i came up with USC haveing 6 or 7 more, but not necesarily all of willie mcginnest class. ray lewis is good, but i am not sure so much better than junior seau.
I am so disgusted by seeing Junior Seau's name in the same sentence that I have no reasonable response.
But here are UM's NFL linebackers 1980 to present:
Made NFL appearances:
David Jefferson, Jay Brophy, Scott Nicolas, Joe Kohlbrand, John McVeigh, Rod Carter, Richard Newbill, Twan Russell, Darrell McClover, Spencer Adkins, Darryl Sharpton, Colin McCarthy.
And the real ones:
Winston Moss
George Mira Jr.
Victor Morris
Randy Shannon
Bernard Clark
Michael Barrow
Darrin Smith
Jessie Armstead
Rohan Marley
Ray Lewis
Nate Webster
Dan Morgan
Jon Vilma
D.J. Williams
Rocky McIntosh
Leon Williams
Jon Beason
Tavares Gooden
that is the great thing about numbers- you can twist em any way you want.
what was great about the AFC central of lyn swann's day is that the best 4 punt returners were all in the same division: swann/steelers, lemar parrish/bengals/ greg pruitt/browns, and the best of em all billy white shoes for the oilers. the early to late 70s AFC central was the toughest division ever in the NFL and caused the league to the second wild card team when houston went 10-4, losing only to the steelers and bengals twice, and watched the playoffs from home.
Not to belabor the point, but while both organizations have produced (past tense) great players, the question really is: Which organization continues to supply the NFL with quality players? Which organization come 2012 draft will avail more first rounders? More overall players into the NFL?
I vote for Matt Leinert as the greatest player in college football history. After all he won the Heisman and he did beat Notre Dame three times. He is also so as my daughter says, "So dreamy." Who cares if he's a pansy ass who took himself out of the game today after a little bruised collarbone.
Forget it the difference between USC and Miami is that USC consists of a team made up of bleached blonde pansy assed beach boys who constantly are patrolling the streets of West Hollywood searching for every cock that they can fit in their mouth while we are THE U!
The economist Ronald Coase used to say (might still say, he's over 100 and still kicking) "If you torture the numbers enough they'll confess to anything".
Fantastic line, one of my favorites.
OC - I'm still not sure what timeframe you're trying to look at when you say "continues". Past 5 years? Last year? 2012? The next 5 years?
My best guess is that you're trying to equate UM's failure in the win column with a failure to produce NFL talent, and there are many Pro Bowlers who have played at UM since they've been down that I could submit as evidence to the contrary.
Great scene on the field after the Broncos win over the Chargers. Tebow walked right by Elway without acknowledging him to hug his offensive coordinator. Good for Tebow. Never much cared for that pervert Elway.
No one is going to argue the fact that the Canes produced a great many number of players from 2001 through 2004, 18 first rounders, if I'm not mistaken. No school can match those numbers. However, that was then, this is now. Check the trend and you'll observe that the U pumped out only Antrel Rolle in 2005, (as a first rounder), and five other "late" first rounders from 06-08. The U failed to send "ANY" first rounders to the NFL in 09, 10, and 11, and unless Lamar Miller catches someone's fancy in 12, this dry spell will continue for the foreseeable future.
Were this a trend among stocks in Wall street investors would be bearish on the U. Meanwhile, USC has sent eight first rounders into the NFL since 2008, and 2012 will most certainly include Kalil and Barkley in the top 10 overall.
To dismiss these obvious facts is seeing collegiate nurturing with green and orange colored glasses.
Dude, I don't care that this kid is a Gator and I don't like the Gators, but this kid is alright. How can you not like what he brings to the dance every day. Just a great, great, great competitor. You just cannot have enough people like him in any endeavor in life.
Who cares? USC is currently on probation and Miami is about to hit the slammer. Plus Miami doesn't even have their own stadium. On the todem pole of sports in this town it goes 1) Phins-Shula, Marino and the Dolphins are the first thing anybody thinks about when Miami sports are brought up 2) Heat-Wade, LeBron, Shaq, Alonzo, Hardaway, etc. from the past 15 or so years make the Heat an easy 2 3) Marlins-should be number 2 because of more championships than the Heat and great players..but they've only made the playoffs twice and have failed to sustain a respectable fanbase 4) Hurricanes-nobody respects the Hurricanes...as evidence by there being 20,000 people at games, more FSU/UF/FIU alums in South Florida, and the fact that everybody on the UM campus is either a brat jew or south american. The football team is irrelevant and it's funny how some of these fans on here like johnny pot smoker and kazam want to pump up a place that they've never attended in the first place. Screw UM and the people who act as though its sports really matter. They are at the bottom of the barrel in this town.
lynn swan played on a running team, but michael irvin DIDN'T?! emmitt smith holds the CAREER record for rushing yardage.. come on, shadow.. irvin blows away any receiver that came out of USC.. considering he shared the football with other great receivers and tight ends, his numbers STILL blow everyone else's away
The calling card of an FIU fan in "Truth hurts" post - it starts with the assumption that anyone actually getting into and paying for UM is a feat completely outside the realm of possibility. 2,000 odd kids do it every year...
OC - well it's very impressive that you can foresee the future of UM's players beyond 2012 but the in the time frame you mentioned, definitely USC is ahead in NFL first rounders.
The Miami New Times is actually a much better source for investigative journalism, they broke the N**** S***** story way before Yahoo, a great article called "The Caligula of Miami" or something similar.
Posted by: I am Kazaam | November 26, 2011 at 05:27 PM
This has to be the greatest sports video of all times for so many reasons. It took me half an hour after I watched it to catch my breath from laughing so hard in order to post it.
conversely, f-i-u-don't-matter draws flies ...
exaggerates crowd size to appear larger & meet D1 requirements ...
but for strong-arming an unsuspecting student body thru obscene activity fees ...
their unwanted athletic program would die a lonely death ...
Posted by: Truth hurts (Quijote)| November 28, 2011 at 02:38 AM
you employ specious logic ...
neither alumnus nor student necessarily equals fan ...
FAN = FAN
case in point: me
I attended uf undergrad & law ...
don't give a flying f_ _k 'bout that school ...
a C-A-N-E to the core ...
Firstly, Green, I am not all those that you claim I am. Doesn't matter if you wish to believe me or not, you're nobody.
Secondly, concerning that shot of an FIU "crowd"... curiously there weren't any teams on the field, or coaching staff, or golden dazzlers, or band, or nothing. Therefore it was obviously a pregame, or post game, shot. Nice try.
FIU's attendance broke yet another record this year, with sold out crowds (standing room only actually) against UCF and DUKE. This further supports the off season need to close the north end which will further increase capacity.
Thirdly, Ohio State's colors are scarlet and white/grey. UM's colors are orange and green. Per the photograph you kindly referenced (http://jerseygirlsports.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/endzone-view500x333.jpg) seems to me like there are easily ten white/grey shirts for every one green/orange shirt. So again, looks like UM's "home field advantage" if nothing but. But hey, congrats on Al's extension. You've witnessed a decade of mediocrity, and now will enjoy it through the end of this decade as well.
Wow, A lot of Hatin of the U on this blog, I take it as a sign of respect and fear.
It's obvious that you Gay-tors, criminoles and to a lesser extend you FIU'ers are concerned that Miami finally has a Coach that understands and has a plan and the know how to implement it, in time, (and it may take two to three more years for him to get rid of the garbage that Shannon left behind) in time he will prove one of the best coaches in college football.
He IS better than mus-chimp and clue-les Jimbo allready, take your shots now , it won't be long before the U is back on top.
Yeah, I heard about that over the radio as I was driving this morning. Here's a different clip with sound loud enough to hear Mosca tell Kapp - "shove it up your a**."
I'm not one for all this fake name blogging nonsense but I must say it's quite the coincidence that Quijote, after "not" posting anything here for months, happened to read green's response to "Truth hurts" within 20 minutes.
What's more pathetic than Jacory's illiterate ass is people like Kazaam that defend him..almost as if he's the Golden Child. That guy was clown shoes as soon as he set foot on Miami's campus. Case closed. Like I said, credit is deserved if effort is shown and results are favorable (see Ken Dorsey, Dan Morgan, Ed Reed, Jonathan Vilma, etc). If you work hard and produce, you deserve to be complimented. To the players that f*ck up continuously (Jacory, Ray Ray)--you don't deserve to be coddled..if you screw up, you deserve to be told so. If I fall asleep at work for 4 hours and don't produce..my boss isn't going to say "I hate when people attack an employee..he doesn't owe you anything"--NO SIR! He's going to let me know that I'm being a lazy bum. That's life. Jacory, Benjamin, and the rest of you slugs--don't let the door hit you on your way out.
Quijote - I don't even care about FIU and I like DJN's blogs, he's an entertaining writer.
Don't think I've ever seen anyone post a comment on there though...
I am stoned - everyone deserves to be told when they're not performing. No one deserves to be called an illiterate crack dealer because they're not producing on the football field.
Who else thinks that music at Dolphin games is almost as pathetic as the product we've had to endure the last mediocre decade? If I have to listen to another Jimmy Buffett song or "Tell me baby girl cause I need to know" plays again I am going to go crazy. Get the gameday songs going. Pleeeeease. At least make the gameday environment fun.
That one is the real good one, OC. Suffice to say that I was LMFAO when I saw the clip this morning. The video of the fat guy swinging the cane and then getting knocked out is pure gold. The one that yo posted even has the audio. He're is the wikipidia about that fish Mosco.
Greg several sites are now saying UM relinquished any possible bowl invite because they were concerned they might be pitted against FIU. Any truth to this? Wouldn't surprise me, didn't they politely decline yet another invite from FIU to start a series in revenue sports?
emmitt smith had 500 more carries in his career than franco harris, for what that is worth.
john stallworth was five notches better than alvin harper or anyone else who caught the ball for dallas and wound up with better numbers than lynn swann. look at swann making absurd catches, including the super bowl of 14-10 steelers.
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NBA? so what. NBA is a 3rd tier pro sport after NFL & MLB giants. Same for the NHL.
Miami Heat have a great chance of winning it all considering their starting line up talent. Lockout may have benefitted the Heat more then any other NBA team. No offseason, shortened regular season. IMO anyone but the Lakers...
Posted by: Jimbo | November 26, 2011 at 10:29 AM
Jacory Harris... Jacory Harris!!! Jacory "Freaking" Harris.... LMAO
He throws a sweet TD pass--to opposing teams on a regular basis.
Posted by: Jimbo | November 26, 2011 at 10:35 AM
Jimbo - most people hate either the MLB or NBA or both but more people watch the NBA than MLB so you can debate which is a better sport or bring up the completely outdated and untrue "America's pastime" thing but the numbers show that the NBA is the more popular of the two and neither one's popularity is in the same ballpark, city, state, country, planet, or galaxy as the NFL.
Posted by: I am Kazaam | November 26, 2011 at 10:51 AM
When does NASCAR start again ?
Posted by: I Put Ball Thru Hoop ... Now Give Me Millions | November 26, 2011 at 10:52 AM
I thought I was going to have to watch tiddlywinks from jolly old England this winter, but thanks be alive the NBA is back. For a moment there I was having nightmares about actually having to tune in to some sleep inducing college basketball games when the football season ended. Nothing to fear, I can now go back to dreaming that Cote will get off his ass and find the cojones to start an investigative series on Dona Shalala and how she has destroyed the Miami Hurricanes program. Do you do that Cote? Or are you just a tool for the university?
Posted by: Mr. Woodcock | November 26, 2011 at 11:31 AM
Cote, Jim Murray would written an article about the fiasco that is the University of Miami football program. He would have written about the poor attendance at JRS. About the sea of empty seats at every game. He would have written about the failed negotiations to refurbish the Orange Bowl so that the Hurricanes could play their games close to campus in a remodeled stadium. Murray would have written a column asking why corruption has flourished since she came on board. He would have asked why the University allowed boosters like Shapiro to have access to the program. He would have continued to ask the tough questions wanting to know how a nationally ranked program that has won five national championships since 1983 is now playing to in a 3/4 empty stadium 30 miles northwest of its campus and losing embarrassingly to 14 point underdogs at home. But then Jim Murray, may God rest his soul, was a Pulitzer price winner and you are just a stiff collecting a paycheck and paying some intern to run this blog.
Posted by: Mr. Woodcock | November 26, 2011 at 11:44 AM
Another awful Hurricane season. I'm done with the ten year brainwash that we're getting better and taking a step in the right direction.
I'm now going for FIU.
Posted by: no more | November 26, 2011 at 12:22 PM
Interesting how quickly deals come together after unions recognize their very existence is threatened and owners are faced with billion dollar lawsuits.
Posted by: hmm... | November 26, 2011 at 12:27 PM
NBA season starting on Christmas Day is still way too long- as are the games themselves. If they only played the final five minutes the games wouldn't seem to go on for so long!
Posted by: Basil Rathbone | November 26, 2011 at 12:50 PM
Woodcock - while there is some truth to what you say, there is nothing that can be done about Shalala because the good she has done for the university outweighs even the total destruction of the football team in the eyes of the trustees, of which nearly all the "Regular Members" serve because they initially were just big fans of the team.
Whenever I talk about UM most people say I'm not a real fan or I'm just defending Shalala (for god knows what ulterior reason...) but my Hurricane fanhood really is beyond reproach. Both my parents hold multiple degrees from UM. I hold multiple degrees from UM. Both sides of my family's names are on chaired positions and graduate departmental grants and I sit in the president's box for a game or two every year. My grandfather was an usher at the OB for thirty five years. I went to my first UM game before I was 1 year old. I have traveled to every UM national championship game since 1987. I have been to every Orange Bowl game UM has played in since I've been alive. I have seen UM play at FSU, at Ohio State, at Florida, at Notre Dame, at Oklahoma, and at Virginia Tech.
I tell you that hopefully add some measure of credibility to telling you this - just as there's really no point in my explaining Shalala's situation to UM fans who don't care about the university, there's no point in the media vilifying her to the people who run it. She won't be fired because the football team doesn't win, even if everything was all her fault.
I don't buy all the excuses and explanations that have been offered for why UM hasn't been winning this past decade. Joining the mighty ACC? Seems like a stretch, we're usually competitive with the good teams and still lose to the bad ones. No OB? An incredibly sad and stupid decision but the teams of the '80s could beat anyone anywhere. Anyone who had season tickets knows that the OB was just as empty as Joe Robbie for bad games. Boosters? Are you kidding me? That's how college football works. There were boosters when UM was winning championships in the '80s and there are boosters at EVERY major SEC team right now. Only difference is that UM's booster came from their horrible local fanbase and wasn't an alumni who cared about the university. Even if an Alabama or Florida booster made his money illegally he would NEVER throw his alma mater under the bus when he got caught.
Everyone has an opinion about all the reasons UM hasn't been any good in the past decade, mine is two very bad coaches in a row. Period. I don't think it's any more complicated than that.
I'm hoping beyond hope it's not three in a row but it makes me very nervous the way the entire fanbase (including myself) is fawning over a 6-6 coach. I keep the faith and can't wait to see who Golden brings in for his first full recruiting class.
Posted by: I am Kazaam | November 26, 2011 at 01:35 PM
I will say this though - if UM receives heavy sanctions and the NCAA reveals some angle that could be spun as Shalala's being responsible, a large media backlash could force her to retire, she's over 70 years old anyway.
If there was any time for Cote to step up and make a name for himself it would be in the days following the NCAA's announcement of UM's sanctions.
Maybe start working on that draft now so LeBatard doesn't beat you to it.
Posted by: I am Kazaam | November 26, 2011 at 01:38 PM
NBA free agency starting as soon as next week.
Biggest storyline to me is Baron Davis' situation. If Cleveland holds on to him he takes up a huge chunk of their cap and sits behind the #1 pick Kyrie Irving.
If they release him he immediately signs with the Heat for a minimum salary while still collecting the money the Cavs owe him on the year.
So knowing what we know about that owner, is there any chance that fielding a competitive team wins out over spiting LeBron James?
Posted by: I am Kazaam | November 26, 2011 at 01:48 PM
Not bad and well said, Kazaam. Between the lines of what you wrote run the unanswered questions that this community has been itching to learn. My frustration, like that of many Hurricane fans, is that I feel that the media has done almost nothing to seek out the answers to the questions. I use Cote as a vehicle to address the media here because this is his blog and I know that sometimes he actually reads what's been written here. The Miami Herald needs to step up its investigation of the program. It took a Jimmy Olsen type reporter working for Yahoo to bring the Shapiro story to light. At the moment we are in limbo all awaiting what the NCAA will decide but that doesn't mean that the Herald and reporters who work for the paper like Cote should get a free pass. The what, where, who, why, and how, are as important today as they were when Eve convinced Adam to take that bite. What I want are answers to why Shalala and the University made the decisions that ultimately landed this program in the toilet that it's floating in today. A little more investigation and less procrastination please.
Posted by: Mr. Woodcock | November 26, 2011 at 02:41 PM
Yea, the Herald really is hurting for good writers - Edwin Pope has been sweet and senile for many years now, LeBatard only chimes in with articles about race or hyper analysis of fan-media relations, and Cote has never been one to research anything beyond what he can Google.
I've noticed that the guy that now writes FIU's stories, David Neal, is pretty good as a beat writer but I've never seen anything too groundbreaking or controversial out of him.
The Miami New Times is actually a much better source for investigative journalism, they broke the N**** S***** story way before Yahoo, a great article called "The Caligula of Miami" or something similar.
Might be worth emailing the editor at Miami New Times, they all hate UM because most of them went to FIU and they don't seem to get much feedback, pretty much every time I write them about something dumb Uncle Luke said it makes it into the "Letter to the Editor" column.
Posted by: I am Kazaam | November 26, 2011 at 05:27 PM
Jimbo- Whatever happened to Genrai, and Flipper72?
Posted by: Naples Jack | November 26, 2011 at 06:54 PM
Ginrai was drafted by the Palestians to secure the Gaza Strip.
Posted by: Ripper out! | November 26, 2011 at 07:20 PM
Now that's funny.
Posted by: OC Dolphin | November 26, 2011 at 07:29 PM
really good points, kazaam. my father graduated from the university of miami; i grew up in the orange bowl for both the dolphins and the hurricanes. i believe it falls on coaching as well. coker's awful recruiting really put us back too, with the turnaround the gators experienced and the advent of 2 more programs in the state. i hope to god golden can turn this thing around.
was thinking about that 2001 team and shadow's foggy recollections. that team would have destroyed ANY team fielded by USC in history. in fact, if you could put together an all star USC team throughout history, that miami team would have eaten them alive
Posted by: david in los angeles | November 26, 2011 at 10:12 PM
it's funny here in los angeles, listening to these cats out here getting all butt hurt about their pac 12, and how the SEC shouldn't have all the attention.
if USC played in the SEC, they MIGHT have won once in the last 10 years..
Posted by: david in los angeles | November 26, 2011 at 10:15 PM
david in los angeles,
once in the last ten years? think before you type, please. there wasn't anybody in the SEC better than USC at the end of the 2002 season, the one with UM/OSU for the vase and carson palmer wining the heisman. and according to our beloved michigan grad, jim mandich, RIP, the trojans were playing better than anyone at season's end. destroyed iowa in the orange bowl with troy with the crazy hair riding the bicycle on the sideline the entire game. next year they split the title with the humans voting for uSC and LSU winning the vase. the next year USC crusg=hed oklahoma for the title; one time in ten years, my friend?
Posted by: the shadow knows | November 26, 2011 at 11:15 PM
Nobody really cares about your life story Kazaam. It's low of you to bash other Hurricane fans and try to belittle them. That's why most on here don't like you. I don't go to Dolphin games and speak in a holier than thou way to other Phin fans. Rather, I like the fact that they are fellow Dolphin fans and I try to enjoy the game ALONG with them. Makes sense. Taking your venom out on people of the same fanbase just makes you look foolish.
Posted by: I am stoned | November 26, 2011 at 11:44 PM
To a casual college follower such as myself, USC and UM stand alone as powerhouses within certain periods in time. As we sit here today, I'd say that SC's program is in a far better place than that of Mia. The Canes are reeling, while the Trojans are aroused and exposed.
Posted by: OC Dolphin | November 27, 2011 at 12:39 AM
btw,
that's just the way that Woodcock likes to see them show up...Aroused and exposed!
Posted by: OC Dolphin | November 27, 2011 at 12:41 AM
meanwhile...SC is shellacking UCLA 50-zip.
Posted by: OC Dolphin | November 27, 2011 at 12:56 AM
We've had discussions on here before about it. Make no mistake about it. Miami is NFL U. Not SC.
Posted by: I am stoned | November 27, 2011 at 01:07 AM
f**k that, stoner. Just jump into the back of my GTO and light it up. Let's hit the beach.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OQXo2N5aYrA
Posted by: hittin that 19yr fine young thing | November 27, 2011 at 01:37 AM
Of course not. The only thing that Trojans are good for is to hold my jizz.
Posted by: Mr. Woodcock | November 27, 2011 at 02:01 AM
I am stoned,
I give you the 80's. Miami produced double digit great players through that period and they were the undisputed #1 NFL production factory. That being said when one takes a longer view, more importantly, how things are now, any objective eye would say that SC continues the tradition while Mia. is no where i the same discussion. It is what it is.
Last best UM player who distinguished himself in the NFL is who? Try matching that output vs. the slew of linebackers and QB's making a name today.
Preview: #1 - Luck, #2 - Kalil (USC), #3- Barkley (USC)
Posted by: OC Dolphin | November 27, 2011 at 02:02 AM
And that comment my friends is why OC Dolphin is a freaking idiot.
The only thing that trojans are good for is to hold my jizz.
Posted by: Mr. Woodcock | November 27, 2011 at 02:18 AM
Was that Jacory Harris playing quarterback for Florida today in the first half? Or was it Obama?
Posted by: Mr. Woodcock | November 27, 2011 at 02:20 AM
Blow me Woody,
Make the case that Miami Hurricanes program is set to produce more NFL ready players than SC. Make the case that they have done so for the past 5 years...and I'm being generous. Florida and Florida St. have posted better than the U.
Posted by: OC Dolphin | November 27, 2011 at 02:21 AM
There are easily 5 players from SC who will be picked in the draft ahead of Ray-Ray. What, you're telling me that the U is still a NFL factory? Yeah, right!
Posted by: OC Dolphin | November 27, 2011 at 02:26 AM
Suck OC, suck, blow is just a figure of speech.
Posted by: Mr. Woodcock | November 27, 2011 at 02:57 AM
Even our second string, like Sam Shields who couldn't break into our lineup at Miami goes to the pros and wins a Superbowl ring as one of the starting corners for the World Champ Green Bay Packers. Jimmy Graham is the top tight end in the NFL and he only played one season at Miami.
The only thing that Trojans are good for is to hold my jizz.
Posted by: Mr. Woodcock | November 27, 2011 at 03:00 AM
I recorded the FSU v. Fla. game today and I'm sitting here watching it right now. That "has" to be Jacory Harris playing quarterback for the Gaytors tonight. He he he. There's something uplifting about seeing the Gaytors take it up the ass at home. Couldn't have happened to a nicer bunch of guys.
Posted by: Mr. Woodcock | November 27, 2011 at 03:05 AM
I Had Sexual Intercourse with Ms Shalala.. Has a Hairy bush.
Posted by: The Anti-Christ | November 27, 2011 at 03:20 AM
Hey, i sold hot dogs during the 72 season at the Orange Bowl. That don't make me an undefeated concessionary guy. For that matter, I remember that you sitting next to Charles Nelson Reilly over at Chasens, that don't make you partial to wienerschnitzel...ehr...I take that back.
Posted by: OC Dolphin | November 27, 2011 at 03:22 AM
I feel sorry for you, Anti.
Posted by: OC Dolphin | November 27, 2011 at 03:24 AM
No school can match this group of legends. Miami produces studs at EVERY POSITION. USC can't compete..
QBs:
Jim Kelly (HOF)
Bernie Kosar
Vinny Testaverde (Heisman)
RBs:
Frank Gore (top 5 RB today)
Willis McGahee
Edgerrin James (10,000 rushing yds club)
Clinton Portis (almost at 10,000 yds rushing)
Ottis Anderson (10,000 rushing yds club)
WRs:
Eddie Brown
Michael Irvin (HOF)
Andre Johnson (best WR in NFL today-just injured now)
Leonard Hankerson
Santana Moss
Reggie Wayne (potential for HOF)
Roscoe Parrish
TEs:
Jimmy Graham (best tight end in NFL today)
Kellen Winslow
Greg Olsen
Bubba Franks
Jeremy Shockey
Oline:
Eric Winston
Chris Myers
Jim Otto (HOF)
Leon Searcy
Bryant McKinnie
Dline:
Kenard Lang
Kenny Holmes
Daniel Stubbs
Vince Wilfork (best NT in NFL today)
Jerome Brown
Russ Maryland
Warren Sapp (arguably greatest DT of all time)
Damione Lewis
Dwayne Johnson
LBers:
Jessie Armstead
Darrin Smith
Michael Barrow
Jonathan Vilma
Jon Beason
DJ Williams
Ray Lewis (Greatest LB of all time)
Dan Morgan
Ted Hendricks (HOF)
Rohan Marley
DBs
Phil Buchanon
Sean Taylor
Bennie Blades
Darryl Williams
Bubba McDowell
Antrel Rolle
Sam Shields
Duane Starks
Earl Little
Kenny Phillips
Brandon Meriweather
Ed Reed (Greatest S of all time)
Special Teams
Devin Hester (Greatest KR of all time)
Posted by: I am stoned | November 27, 2011 at 04:36 AM
Sick of hearing about USC. They are vastly overrated as professionals. Plenty turn out to be stiffs. Matt Leinart was a big time bust. Reggie Bush has NEVER lived up to the hype-he has small spurts of effectiveness. LenDale White was a disappointment. Carson Palmer has been decent. Mark Sanchez= way overrated. I mean you mention Marcus Allen and OJ...but for really you don't have too much after that. They were fine players, but Miami just puts out a lot more.
Posted by: I am stoned | November 27, 2011 at 04:45 AM
for real*..the crippy must've kicked in.
Posted by: I am stoned | November 27, 2011 at 04:46 AM
No one forced you to read my life story "I am stoned".
I don't care if anyone complains about UM players' performance, I don't even care if anyone asininely sits behind their computer complaining about the effort of kids who are at practice at 6:30 every morning.
But for you to say that Jacory Harris, Travis Benjamin, and Ray Ray Armstrong are a bunch of entitled and illiterate asses who are going to be dealing crack in back alleys, and to honestly think that players like Warren Sapp and Michael Irvin and Ed Reed would agree with you????
I wasn't just popping off, as far as UM football goes, I couldn't be more heartfelt or sincere when I say f*ck you.
Posted by: I am Kazaam | November 27, 2011 at 08:15 AM
Jimbo - I think it was you that brought this up a while back, as a rule I disagree with everything Rick Reily says so no, apparently Aaron Rogers has not already surpassed Brett Favre.
http://espn.go.com/espn/story/_/id/7272995/rick-reilly-rodgers-better-favre
Posted by: I am Kazaam | November 27, 2011 at 08:26 AM
The argument that I am making is not that Miami failed to produce great players, my argument is that they have stopped doing so, whereas SC continues. I'm talking tortoise and the hare, here. SC just keeps plugging along. At the start of this NFL season the list of active ex-Trojans on team rosters totaled 55.
http://www.usctrojans.com/sports/m-footbl/trojans-in-the-nfl.html
Posted by: OC Dolphin | November 27, 2011 at 12:31 PM
Sacrilege! How dare you soil the pages of this blog with that trojan (The only thing that trojans are good for is to hold my jizz)web site. The very one that banned me for life after 15 minutes. Why you might as well just publish Fidel's website about his revolution's successes on this blog.
Sir, you are an idiot.
Posted by: Mr. Woodcock | November 27, 2011 at 12:45 PM
There are 64 active ex-Hurricanes on NFL rosters.
Doesn't speak to their talent of course but some of them are pretty good...
Posted by: I am Kazaam | November 27, 2011 at 12:46 PM
So, let me get this correct. You are stating that the Canes "CONTINUE" to be an NFL pipeline?
Posted by: OC Dolphin | November 27, 2011 at 12:53 PM
btw, Kaz. You're saying 64 current players? Sounds a bit high. Can you provide a source?
Posted by: OC Dolphin | November 27, 2011 at 01:05 PM
Why don't you just consult your crystal ball?
Posted by: Mr. Woodcock | November 27, 2011 at 01:41 PM
S*** it would have been more exciting for NBA to be locked out permanehtly and listen to all B-Ball fans whine and B-Ball players have to move to europe HA HA HA bunch of pussies...
Posted by: Bill Lanier | November 27, 2011 at 01:58 PM
all of you in the UM/USC debate:
there is no question that USC has sent the most players into the NFL over the years. UM has had a swlew of players, but UM's top five runners are 3-4-5 after oj simpson and marcus allen. michael irvin HOF- so is lynn swann. OL candidae of the canes jim otto- usc has ron mix, bruce matthews, the greatest OLman in history in anthony munoz and tony boselli waiting in the wings. jimmy graham is a nice story, but not close to charles young as a receiver or blocker. DBs? ronnie lott, most people's candidate as greatest DB (meaning all positions, and especially safety. let us make a distinction between pros and college careers to unmuddle the picture- none of the five canes listed as runners were better than ricky bell, RIP, an untacklable combination of 4.4./4.5 speed. 6'3" and 230 pounds. sam cinningham was a better back than every one of the five canes listed but mackay made a blocking fullback out of him, exceppting for four dives over ohio state and woody hayes' prize goal line defense in the 73 rose bowl. some of the UM players listed are bums and fish worth throwing back-BUBBA FRANKS!!!!!KENARD LANG!!!ray lewis greatest LB of all-time? your opinion, but butkus he ain't, nitschke he aint, and wasn't lawrence taylor a LB? most of the UM players listed are good, but not the greatest ever to play at their positions. eric winston is a good player, but is he yary, mix, munoz or even tony boselli? just keep on supplying the candidates from coral gables and we will take a microscopic look at their careers put them on the lower shelves wher they belong in the supermarket of NFL players. no disagreement about ed reed being at the top of today's safety list, but he wouldn't rank above the fabulously talented kenny easly of UCLA/seahawks whose had a very short 5 years but is nose and nose with ronnie lott to the wire for greatest safety ever.
Posted by: the shadow knows | November 27, 2011 at 05:32 PM
OC - ya, counted from the "Miami Hurricanes in the NFL" wikipedia page.
Shadow - Ray Lewis is the greatest linebacker that has ever played the game.
Go by the numbers. Go by their play. Go by anything other than just deifying players who happened to play in an older generation and you come to that conclusion.
Posted by: I am Kazaam | November 27, 2011 at 05:49 PM
USC have any tight ends that did more in the NFL than Kellen Winslow or Jeremy Shockey?
Posted by: I am Kazaam | November 27, 2011 at 05:50 PM
Kazaam,
charle young; will go check out the stats on jeremy shockey and kellen winslow, neither of whom could block your mother. charle (tree) young was a TE in the era when the position demanded that the TE be as much a blocker as pass catcher, and he was good at both. kellen winslow the II and jeremy shockey are deinitely on the all-mouth team.
Posted by: the shadow knows | November 27, 2011 at 05:58 PM
HOFer ≠ HOFer.
Lynn Swan: 336 rec, 5,462 yds, 51 TD.
Michael Irvin: 750 rec, 11,904 yds, 65 TD.
Posted by: I am Kazaam | November 27, 2011 at 05:58 PM
Kazaam,
lynn swann played on a primarily running team, and like paul warfield doesn't have eye-popping stats except for yads/catch. swann a;lso had john stallworth on the other side who maddog, RIP, thought was a better passcatcher but not the athlete that swann was. have we forgotten the juggling, didving catched in the SB against dallas that won the game for the steelers?
now, on to the TE comparison:
charle young (clasmate at USC in california history at USC and was six four and 235 i believe: charle in 14 game seasons for most of his careeer methinks: 418 catches, 5,106 yds, 27TDs, and 12.2 yds/catch.
shockey: 534 catches, 5.999 yards, 11.2/catch and 34 TDS
winslow "the warrior": 409 catches, 4549 yds, 11.1yds/catch, 23 TDs.
you decide on what is more, but charle young was eally the first "athletic" TE i believe and was a great guy; shockey and winslow aren't in the most likable division of ball players.
what did your wiikipedia page say about the LB count? doing it long-hand, from 1980-present i came up with USC haveing 6 or 7 more, but not necesarily all of willie mcginnest class. ray lewis is good, but i am not sure so much better than junior seau.
Posted by: the shadow knows | November 27, 2011 at 06:15 PM
I am so disgusted by seeing Junior Seau's name in the same sentence that I have no reasonable response.
But here are UM's NFL linebackers 1980 to present:
Made NFL appearances:
David Jefferson, Jay Brophy, Scott Nicolas, Joe Kohlbrand, John McVeigh, Rod Carter, Richard Newbill, Twan Russell, Darrell McClover, Spencer Adkins, Darryl Sharpton, Colin McCarthy.
And the real ones:
Winston Moss
George Mira Jr.
Victor Morris
Randy Shannon
Bernard Clark
Michael Barrow
Darrin Smith
Jessie Armstead
Rohan Marley
Ray Lewis
Nate Webster
Dan Morgan
Jon Vilma
D.J. Williams
Rocky McIntosh
Leon Williams
Jon Beason
Tavares Gooden
Posted by: I am Kazaam | November 27, 2011 at 06:24 PM
Of those at least Armstead, Vilma, and Beason had/have better careers than Willie Mcginnest.
Safe to say you underestimated the low end USC players but near as I can tell UM has the best linebacker and more great linebackers than USC.
Posted by: I am Kazaam | November 27, 2011 at 06:28 PM
Kazaam,
your numbers in play:
swann: TD per 6+ catches
irvin: TD per 11+ catches
that is the great thing about numbers- you can twist em any way you want.
what was great about the AFC central of lyn swann's day is that the best 4 punt returners were all in the same division: swann/steelers, lemar parrish/bengals/ greg pruitt/browns, and the best of em all billy white shoes for the oilers. the early to late 70s AFC central was the toughest division ever in the NFL and caused the league to the second wild card team when houston went 10-4, losing only to the steelers and bengals twice, and watched the playoffs from home.
Posted by: the shadow knows | November 27, 2011 at 06:28 PM
Not to belabor the point, but while both organizations have produced (past tense) great players, the question really is: Which organization continues to supply the NFL with quality players? Which organization come 2012 draft will avail more first rounders? More overall players into the NFL?
Posted by: OC Dolphin | November 27, 2011 at 06:39 PM
I vote for Matt Leinert as the greatest player in college football history. After all he won the Heisman and he did beat Notre Dame three times. He is also so as my daughter says, "So dreamy." Who cares if he's a pansy ass who took himself out of the game today after a little bruised collarbone.
Posted by: Mr. Woodcock | November 27, 2011 at 06:48 PM
Why don't you consult your crystal ball, OC, and let us all know.
Posted by: Mr. Woodcock | November 27, 2011 at 06:49 PM
Forget it the difference between USC and Miami is that USC consists of a team made up of bleached blonde pansy assed beach boys who constantly are patrolling the streets of West Hollywood searching for every cock that they can fit in their mouth while we are THE U!
Posted by: Mr. Woodcock | November 27, 2011 at 06:51 PM
The economist Ronald Coase used to say (might still say, he's over 100 and still kicking) "If you torture the numbers enough they'll confess to anything".
Fantastic line, one of my favorites.
OC - I'm still not sure what timeframe you're trying to look at when you say "continues". Past 5 years? Last year? 2012? The next 5 years?
My best guess is that you're trying to equate UM's failure in the win column with a failure to produce NFL talent, and there are many Pro Bowlers who have played at UM since they've been down that I could submit as evidence to the contrary.
Posted by: I am Kazaam | November 27, 2011 at 07:05 PM
Forget it Kazaam, he's on a roll......of toilet paper.
Posted by: Mr. Woodcock | November 27, 2011 at 07:12 PM
Great scene on the field after the Broncos win over the Chargers. Tebow walked right by Elway without acknowledging him to hug his offensive coordinator. Good for Tebow. Never much cared for that pervert Elway.
Posted by: Tom | November 27, 2011 at 07:53 PM
Kazaam,
No one is going to argue the fact that the Canes produced a great many number of players from 2001 through 2004, 18 first rounders, if I'm not mistaken. No school can match those numbers. However, that was then, this is now. Check the trend and you'll observe that the U pumped out only Antrel Rolle in 2005, (as a first rounder), and five other "late" first rounders from 06-08. The U failed to send "ANY" first rounders to the NFL in 09, 10, and 11, and unless Lamar Miller catches someone's fancy in 12, this dry spell will continue for the foreseeable future.
Were this a trend among stocks in Wall street investors would be bearish on the U. Meanwhile, USC has sent eight first rounders into the NFL since 2008, and 2012 will most certainly include Kalil and Barkley in the top 10 overall.
To dismiss these obvious facts is seeing collegiate nurturing with green and orange colored glasses.
Posted by: OC Dolphin | November 28, 2011 at 12:00 AM
Dude, I don't care that this kid is a Gator and I don't like the Gators, but this kid is alright. How can you not like what he brings to the dance every day. Just a great, great, great competitor. You just cannot have enough people like him in any endeavor in life.
Posted by: Mr. Woodcock | November 28, 2011 at 12:01 AM
Who cares? USC is currently on probation and Miami is about to hit the slammer. Plus Miami doesn't even have their own stadium. On the todem pole of sports in this town it goes 1) Phins-Shula, Marino and the Dolphins are the first thing anybody thinks about when Miami sports are brought up 2) Heat-Wade, LeBron, Shaq, Alonzo, Hardaway, etc. from the past 15 or so years make the Heat an easy 2 3) Marlins-should be number 2 because of more championships than the Heat and great players..but they've only made the playoffs twice and have failed to sustain a respectable fanbase 4) Hurricanes-nobody respects the Hurricanes...as evidence by there being 20,000 people at games, more FSU/UF/FIU alums in South Florida, and the fact that everybody on the UM campus is either a brat jew or south american. The football team is irrelevant and it's funny how some of these fans on here like johnny pot smoker and kazam want to pump up a place that they've never attended in the first place. Screw UM and the people who act as though its sports really matter. They are at the bottom of the barrel in this town.
Posted by: Truth hurts | November 28, 2011 at 02:38 AM
lynn swan played on a running team, but michael irvin DIDN'T?! emmitt smith holds the CAREER record for rushing yardage.. come on, shadow.. irvin blows away any receiver that came out of USC.. considering he shared the football with other great receivers and tight ends, his numbers STILL blow everyone else's away
Posted by: david in los angeles | November 28, 2011 at 08:01 AM
Congrats to FIU & FSU. At 8-4, they both share the title for best record in the state!
Posted by: Sharpie | November 28, 2011 at 09:13 AM
Haha, that's adorable Sharpie.
The calling card of an FIU fan in "Truth hurts" post - it starts with the assumption that anyone actually getting into and paying for UM is a feat completely outside the realm of possibility. 2,000 odd kids do it every year...
OC - well it's very impressive that you can foresee the future of UM's players beyond 2012 but the in the time frame you mentioned, definitely USC is ahead in NFL first rounders.
Posted by: I am Kazaam | November 28, 2011 at 09:41 AM
david in los angeles,
going way up the thread and reading that the all-time USC team woulkd lose to the 2001 canes- you are nuts!!!!
SOURCE: ESPN college football encyclopdia
best team 2001 canes- edwin pope (provincial, wouldn't you say)
best team 1972 trojans-keith jackson, michael mccambridge, and blackie sherrod.
lee corso says USC 2004 and kirk hirbstreit says USC 2005.
another point to consider is that UM did not have an adequate back-up to dorsey, while mike rae had pat haden, a very good college QB on the bench.
and with that i am out of the UM/USC "debate". UM of 2001 was awesome, as was USC of 1972.
Posted by: the shadow knows | November 28, 2011 at 09:51 AM
The only thing that trojans are good for is to hold my jizz. Ask OC, his crystal ball will tell you this.
Posted by: Mr. Woodcock | November 28, 2011 at 12:30 PM
The Miami New Times is actually a much better source for investigative journalism, they broke the N**** S***** story way before Yahoo, a great article called "The Caligula of Miami" or something similar.
Posted by: I am Kazaam | November 26, 2011 at 05:27 PM
http://eyeonmiami.blogspot.com/2011/08/miami-herald-mystery-how-did-paper-lose.html
Yahoo notes that on August 29 2010 The Herald published, "New book to allege violations made by University of Miami football."
-- eye on miami
barry jackson scooped the competition ...
CREDIT REPAIR
Posted by: green | November 28, 2011 at 12:43 PM
This has to be the greatest sports video of all times for so many reasons. It took me half an hour after I watched it to catch my breath from laughing so hard in order to post it.
http://sports.yahoo.com/sportsminute
Posted by: Mr. Woodcock | November 28, 2011 at 12:43 PM
Posted by: no more (Quijote)| November 26, 2011 at 12:22 PM
Posted by: Truth hurts (Quijote)| November 28, 2011 at 02:38 AM
Posted by: Sharpie (Quijote)| November 28, 2011 at 09:13 AM
a cowardly, oxymoronic f-i-u-don't-matter fan assumes various aliases to conceal obsession ...
OBSESSIVE POPULARITY DISORDER WANNABEES
Posted by: green | November 28, 2011 at 01:10 PM
Congrats to FIU & FSU. At 8-4, they both share the title for best record in the state!
Posted by: Sharpie | November 28, 2011 at 09:13 AM
North Texas
Louisville
UCF
Louisiana-Lafayette
Duke
Akron
Arkansas State
Troy
Western Kentucky
Florida Atlantic
Louisiana-Monroe
Middle Tennessee
Louisiana-Monroe
Charleston Southern
Oklahoma
Clemson
Wake Forest
Duke
Maryland
North Carolina State
Boston College
Miami
Virginia
Florida
APPLES & ORANGES
Posted by: green | November 28, 2011 at 01:16 PM
Hurricanes-nobody respects the Hurricanes...as evidence by there being 20,000 people at games
Posted by: Truth hurts (Quijote)| November 28, 2011 at 02:38 AM
http://jerseygirlsports.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/endzone-view500x333.jpg
on 9/17/11, 66,279 attended U v. ohio state ...
ACTUAL FACTUAL
Posted by: green | November 28, 2011 at 01:30 PM
http://yfrog.com/nuiotltj:tw1
conversely, f-i-u-don't-matter draws flies ...
exaggerates crowd size to appear larger & meet D1 requirements ...
but for strong-arming an unsuspecting student body thru obscene activity fees ...
their unwanted athletic program would die a lonely death ...
ORPHAN'S PARADOX
Posted by: green | November 28, 2011 at 01:48 PM
more FSU/UF/FIU alums in South Florida
Posted by: Truth hurts (Quijote)| November 28, 2011 at 02:38 AM
you employ specious logic ...
neither alumnus nor student necessarily equals fan ...
FAN = FAN
case in point: me
I attended uf undergrad & law ...
don't give a flying f_ _k 'bout that school ...
a C-A-N-E to the core ...
SOULMATE
Posted by: green | November 28, 2011 at 01:53 PM
University of Miami at the bottom of the barrel in this town.
Posted by: Truth hurts (Quijote)| November 28, 2011 at 02:38 AM
TOP OF YOUR MIND
Posted by: green | November 28, 2011 at 01:58 PM
Quijote here...
Firstly, Green, I am not all those that you claim I am. Doesn't matter if you wish to believe me or not, you're nobody.
Secondly, concerning that shot of an FIU "crowd"... curiously there weren't any teams on the field, or coaching staff, or golden dazzlers, or band, or nothing. Therefore it was obviously a pregame, or post game, shot. Nice try.
FIU's attendance broke yet another record this year, with sold out crowds (standing room only actually) against UCF and DUKE. This further supports the off season need to close the north end which will further increase capacity.
Thirdly, Ohio State's colors are scarlet and white/grey. UM's colors are orange and green. Per the photograph you kindly referenced (http://jerseygirlsports.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/endzone-view500x333.jpg) seems to me like there are easily ten white/grey shirts for every one green/orange shirt. So again, looks like UM's "home field advantage" if nothing but. But hey, congrats on Al's extension. You've witnessed a decade of mediocrity, and now will enjoy it through the end of this decade as well.
I'm done here.
Posted by: Quijote | November 28, 2011 at 02:23 PM
Quijote here...
Posted by: Quijote | November 28, 2011 at 02:23 PM
BAT SIGNAL
Posted by: green | November 28, 2011 at 02:32 PM
FIU's attendance broke yet another record this year, with sold out crowds
Posted by: Quijote | November 28, 2011 at 02:23 PM
http://i.ytimg.com/vi/u-uS9e_W9Is/0.jpg
Alfonso Field at FIU Stadium opened its gates on September 20, 2008. The stadium currently has a capacity of 18,000
-- fiusports.com
BANDBOX
Posted by: green | November 28, 2011 at 02:38 PM
Wow, A lot of Hatin of the U on this blog, I take it as a sign of respect and fear.
It's obvious that you Gay-tors, criminoles and to a lesser extend you FIU'ers are concerned that Miami finally has a Coach that understands and has a plan and the know how to implement it, in time, (and it may take two to three more years for him to get rid of the garbage that Shannon left behind) in time he will prove one of the best coaches in college football.
He IS better than mus-chimp and clue-les Jimbo allready, take your shots now , it won't be long before the U is back on top.
Posted by: FZB | November 28, 2011 at 02:42 PM
Woodcock,
Yeah, I heard about that over the radio as I was driving this morning. Here's a different clip with sound loud enough to hear Mosca tell Kapp - "shove it up your a**."
Hilarious!
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/957611-joe-kapp-angelo-mosca-fight-video-watch-cfl-legends-engage-in-shocking-brawl
Posted by: OC Dolphin | November 28, 2011 at 02:44 PM
Thirdly, Ohio State's colors are scarlet and white/grey. UM's colors are orange and green. Per the photograph you kindly referenced
Posted by: Quijote | November 28, 2011 at 02:23 PM
http://media.miamiherald.com/smedia/2011/09/17/23/55/M9WMH.Em.56.jpg
BOOM SHAKALAKA
Posted by: green | November 28, 2011 at 02:44 PM
Green ... you're nobody.
Posted by: Quijote | November 28, 2011 at 02:23 PM
NOBODY'S FOOL
Posted by: green | November 28, 2011 at 02:46 PM
I guess Sandusky will not be doing any Santa Mall gigs this year.
Posted by: OC Dolphin | November 28, 2011 at 03:49 PM
I'm not one for all this fake name blogging nonsense but I must say it's quite the coincidence that Quijote, after "not" posting anything here for months, happened to read green's response to "Truth hurts" within 20 minutes.
Posted by: I am Kazaam | November 28, 2011 at 04:17 PM
Kaza,
I've been reading, but haven't posted for a while. Seriously, this blog is getting silly. Just hasn't been much worthy replying to.
David Neal's, and Pete Pelegrin's, blogs on the other hand have not only been a worthy read, but worthy of interaction as well.
Posted by: Quijote | November 28, 2011 at 04:32 PM
What's more pathetic than Jacory's illiterate ass is people like Kazaam that defend him..almost as if he's the Golden Child. That guy was clown shoes as soon as he set foot on Miami's campus. Case closed. Like I said, credit is deserved if effort is shown and results are favorable (see Ken Dorsey, Dan Morgan, Ed Reed, Jonathan Vilma, etc). If you work hard and produce, you deserve to be complimented. To the players that f*ck up continuously (Jacory, Ray Ray)--you don't deserve to be coddled..if you screw up, you deserve to be told so. If I fall asleep at work for 4 hours and don't produce..my boss isn't going to say "I hate when people attack an employee..he doesn't owe you anything"--NO SIR! He's going to let me know that I'm being a lazy bum. That's life. Jacory, Benjamin, and the rest of you slugs--don't let the door hit you on your way out.
Posted by: I am stoned | November 28, 2011 at 04:36 PM
Quijote - I don't even care about FIU and I like DJN's blogs, he's an entertaining writer.
Don't think I've ever seen anyone post a comment on there though...
I am stoned - everyone deserves to be told when they're not performing. No one deserves to be called an illiterate crack dealer because they're not producing on the football field.
Posted by: I am Kazaam | November 28, 2011 at 05:18 PM
Who else thinks that music at Dolphin games is almost as pathetic as the product we've had to endure the last mediocre decade? If I have to listen to another Jimmy Buffett song or "Tell me baby girl cause I need to know" plays again I am going to go crazy. Get the gameday songs going. Pleeeeease. At least make the gameday environment fun.
Posted by: I am stoned | November 28, 2011 at 08:13 PM
Green there was nothing to take from your "comebacks".
I have to agree with Quijote... I was at the Duke game and it was packed.
Posted by: Lame | November 28, 2011 at 08:25 PM
That one is the real good one, OC. Suffice to say that I was LMFAO when I saw the clip this morning. The video of the fat guy swinging the cane and then getting knocked out is pure gold. The one that yo posted even has the audio. He're is the wikipidia about that fish Mosco.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angelo_Mosca
Posted by: Mr. Woodcock | November 28, 2011 at 11:33 PM
Greg several sites are now saying UM relinquished any possible bowl invite because they were concerned they might be pitted against FIU. Any truth to this? Wouldn't surprise me, didn't they politely decline yet another invite from FIU to start a series in revenue sports?
Posted by: Acer | November 29, 2011 at 11:43 AM
david in los angeles,
emmitt smith had 500 more carries in his career than franco harris, for what that is worth.
john stallworth was five notches better than alvin harper or anyone else who caught the ball for dallas and wound up with better numbers than lynn swann. look at swann making absurd catches, including the super bowl of 14-10 steelers.
Posted by: the shadow knows | November 29, 2011 at 11:48 AM
Unless scandalous revelations are imminent, there is no way the Herald will investigate irregularities at UM.
Why? UM's athletic dept. would blackball the Herald's reporters.
Mr. Cote and his cohorts are trying to survive.
They remember Bill Braucher, a Herald reporter chased out of town because he picked the vikings over the dolphins at the super ball.
Posted by: Sebastian the ibis | November 29, 2011 at 11:56 AM