The chorus for Beck grows louder

     [Updated Monday with the news that Cleo Lemon, not John Beck, would start this week's game vs. Buffalo. Story here. Mind-boggling...]

     Buddy Dan Le Batard added his impressive voice Sunday to the chorus advocating common sense and pushing the Dolphins to start, and so we bumped back up our post on the subject from early last week.

     Here is what ran originally under the headline, 'Huizenga should step in and demand Beck':

     Enough is enough. Cam Cameron seems stuck in indecision on what to do at quarterback. So Wayne Huizenga -- though loathe to play the heavy-handed owner -- should step in during this bye week and force the issue. There is zero reason, at 0-8, to stick with journeyman Cleo Lemon. There is every reason to find out this season whether Beck is the man to lead this franchise into the future.

     If Cam can't make the right decision, somebody else needs to make it for him.

     I wrote this several weeks ago when Trent Green was first hurt. Then loved what Jimmy Johnson said more recently in favor of deploying Beck, noting he is 26 and saying with tongue in cheek, "I hope they play him before he retires."

     As the beer company T-shirt says: Life Beckons.

     Now!

Comments

[Run Jesse Run]

Cam squared isn't holding out Beck because he thinks Cleo gives him a chance to win; he doesn't want to throw Beck to the wolves before he's ready. He did that previously when he was in Washington and the QB there never recovered. I'm sure he's explained himself to Huizenga, who still has faith in Cam's ability to make the right decision for the franchise. No way Huizenga steps in. That being said, the Bills are the easiest team left on the schedule (twice) so don't be surprised if Beck starts after the bye.

[Tom]

`What are you talknig about Cote? He should fire the idiot immediately.

[Alex]

for all we know, Cam will make a change at QB......and name Marty Booker QB!!!!!!

[DolfanTom]

I still have faith in Cam to get this team turned around .... but that faith is gone if Beck isn't under center in two weeks! This is such an obvious move, if he doesn't make it, his logic has to be questioned! I hope H.Wayne does say something - subtle, yes - but something!

[Fish in 2010]

What is the point in holding Beck out because of what happened to Heath Shuler. Shuler could not have made it in the NFL if he held a clipboard for his first five years. He just did not have the talent necessary. Isn't that what we need to find out about Beck. Play him NOW.

[Tom]

Shuler's problem is that he's an idiot. Somewhat akin to Cam. He had one of the lowest intelligence scores for a QB in the history of the combine. Now he's a US Congressman from North Carolina. Sure speaks volumes about what it takes to be a leader in this country -- not much!

[AlA]

if cam doesn't play beck then he needs to get the f**k out of town

[Iz]

How you guys need to chill. Have they even had a practice yet since they came back from london?

[Fisheye]

Have some patience and let the man coach his team. He finally shaped an effective O-line, and the Dolphins have a working running game. Next step is solidifying the defense. QB at this point is irrelevant. That'll be the next to last piece of the puzzle. Beck should see some action, but towards the end of the season.

[Rick D]

The problem is, if Beck doesn't come in and look like Marino in his first game, the whole city of Miami will be screaming "BUST! BUST!" just like they did when Ted Ginn didn't have a TD on a punt return his first game.
Cam isn't perfect, but he's a much better judge of whether Beck is ready, than anybody on this board.
And even if Beck does play, 8 games is not enough to judge him on -- look at Peyton Manning's first 8 games, and judge him...

[Tom]

I've heard this nonsense all season long that Cam is a better judge than all of us at this or that. Bullshit. This guy is absolutely clueless. No one in their right mind picks a punt returner with the 9th overall pick. We are now the worst team in the league and he is still acting as if winning this year matters. My goodness when will all of you wake up to the fact that Cam is a loser. 18-45 lifetime as a head coach did not come by accident. He earned every one of those losses with a level of incompetence that has rarely been challenged in the history of football.

If Wayne H has any sense at all he'll dump this clown as fast as possible.

[Rick D]

Tom - I feel your frustration. But you're making my point for me, running Cam out of town after 1/2 a season. Wannstadt was 11-5 his first season in Miami, does that make him a good head coach?
Loser as a head coach or not, Cam knows how to coach up a QB better than you. He'll play Beck when he's ready.
And I would rather NOT start all over again, with another new frickin coach right now! Lets try stability for a change.
PS. Please dont run Beck out of town after he throws a couple INTs in his first game.

[hey there, how's your steak?]

Staightfowardly, I mean, let's get real Greg: Who gives a flying f what the heck Cam does or what the heck Wayne says? They're both an Aunt Sally, and, it's not a shame because, when you have an inferior head coach along with with an owner who is unschooled in football ownership (even after all these years), HOW COULD ANYONE ACTUALLY GIVE A CARE? 0-8 and they won't play the youngsters? Yunno, technically they are 0-11 if you include the three losses they ended last season with. They prance around in their aqua unis and their high heels and talk smack (Joey) when, not only are they getting beat, but they're getting embarrassed and laughed at. Hey guy, THEY LOST TO THE EFFIN JETS, don't forget, and, everybody thinks they have a chance to beat the Bills? That's not gonna be a cakewalk, pal. I'm done going off on the Phins' patheticalness; I just sit back and join in on the laughter, yeah, the joke that is: The Miami Dolphins ...

[unhappy dolfan]

brady quinn brady quinn brady quinn

[DP Naples]

It amazes me that so many people posting in blogs are so irate about what is going on with the team. I think that everyone should calm down and let this thing work itself out. Many of you are acting like it needs to get fixed now. Forget that notion, it is going take a long time to fix this. Carrying this kind of anger isn't doing anyone any good, especially yourselves. Cameron is a good man, the best the team has had in a very long time. If they can have some good drafts that stick, the defense will get better. There are far greater problems there than on offense. Beck will get his chance to play this year, there is no way he doesn't. It is impossible for him to not get some playing time this year. You will know what you need to know about him soon enough. Granted, I would play him now, but Cameron is making that call, not any of us. All this ranting isn't going to get him in the lineup any sooner. This team is going to look a lot differnt after the next draft. A high pick wil likely get Dorsey out of LSU or some other very strong interior defensive lineman, then the D-backs will follow. Next year is the real year you need to begin evaluating the progress of this team, not this year.

[Jack]

You want a good laugh? Take a look at the FIN'S web site! (1) A countdown clock to the next game against Buffalo. Like someone on death row marking off the days in chalk on the wall. (2) A chance to ask Cam a question. Like, why aren't you a plumber or the guy that fixes your cable? (3) The Two Michelles !! Who are they and why do we care?? (4) A Ted Ginn, Jr. autographed football. Gee, that one will be worth mucho dinero in a couple years. Here's a thought for the web site .... a black wreath with a shroud covering the dead dolphin. Cam in prison clothes; Wayne laughing all the way to the bank.

[DP Naples]

I have another thought for everyone. A few weeks ago, Jason Taylor jumped off sides and negated a third-down stop. The third down was converted on the next play and eventually a TD was scored. In London, JT was called for defensive holding negating an interception by Jason Allen. Why is nobody ranting about JT's play this year, he has been horrible by his standards.

[mal]

to be honest, playing beck in week 10 might not be a great idea because it is somewhat of a lose-lose scenario. if he does well and starts leading miami to victory, the dolphins might forfeit the #1 pick in the draft next year to some team like st louis. but if he doesn't do well, he might lose any confidence in his ability to play at this level and miami's hand might be forced into taking a quarterback next year with the #1 overall when we have a need at almost every position on the roster.

wait until we lose three or four more games, and if beck's ready, and only if he's ready, then play him. four or five games is more than a big enough sample size to see if a guy has what it takes (just look at cleo).

[zulu]

What a bunch of yoyo comments. All of you combined, includeing the sports writers don't know jack compard to what the coach knows. If he is planning on starting Beck, he is just not going to tip his hand on it. Just what we need, fans and sportwriters coaching the team...

[Tom]

The problem is that our leadership SUCKS!!! It's nonexistent. You Cam defenders must have been living in caves for the past 6 months. Those of you who think that all of a sudden Cam is going to start making sense - IT AINT"T GOING TO HAPPEN. He is absolutely clueless. I'm sick of "failing forward fast" and the f****** "Ginn family" and the fact that the "sun is going to come up." Jesus, please forgive me but this guy is making me nuts and I'm about to jump from my 5th floor window. Cam has made one insane decision after another and now it seems as if he is determined that we are never going to have future. There is not a single legitimate excuse for not getting Beck some playing time. Not one. And this crap that Cam has a plan, that's the biggest crock of shit floating around here since saying AJ Feeley was worth a 2nd round pick. I do hope I'm wrong because the last thing we need is another wasted 2nd round draft pick, but I am really starting to believe that Cam doesn't want to unmask the fact that he can pick QB talent either.

WAYNE I'm screaming my ass off at you right now (and it's a big old ass) --

FIRE CAM BEFORE HE DESTROYS WHAT'S LEFT OF YOUR FRANCHISE!!!!!

[Truth Detector]

All these new bloggers on the site supporting Cam. Hmm? Could Cam and friends be in the house?

[SJ Bobkins]

Easy guys, you can't lose enough games to no longer be considered for the next head coach opening. Cam is of the Norv Turner caliber, both will go on coaching for however long they wish, no mater what the level of success. Cam didn't do much to ingrain himself with the comments on draft day about Ginn Junior, maybe he can't think and speak at the same time. But what he was right on was in not picking Brady who still seems to have a bigger fan base in Miami than he does in Cleveland. Cam knows Brady, Cam didn't want Brady, and I think the guy knows QB's What has to happen before the boo-birds shut the hell up about not drafting the guy in the first? Did anyone watch his bowl performance or check out how he did under pressure or in important games. Beck was the whole show, and blasted top 3 rated Oregon 38-8. This season's Oregon team is the same group of guys that Beck destroyed. I don't want to hear the whiners come out, if and when Beck tosses an int. He has to learn, he will be very good, if not great, and have a better career than Brady. That's career, not one game.

[mal]

there is a lot of exuberance regarding this topic it seems, but i challenge anyone to read the entire following argument and provide a coherent and logical argument for starting beck in week 10.

the reasoning is this -- implicit in the call for beck is the assumption that we fully know what miami has in cleo lemon after four professional starts. rationality dictates that there is nothing special about lemon, so this should be a general rule for evaluating quarterbacks (and i think it is, four games is more than enough time to prove yourself). then, it also stands to reason that we will know if beck has the goods by letting him play the same time frame.

letting beck play any more than the time frame of which it is necessary to evaluate him is just stupid. clearly, we cannot win with cleo, and if beck performs better than cleo, he will obviously give us a better chance to win now. but winning now only hurts us as it pushes our draft position further back.

if we do poorly with beck in week 10, it will likely damage his confidence and hurt his prospects to becoming a better pro -- when was the last time you saw a rookie qb who was horrible their rookie year then went on to be good? then, we will need to draft a quarterback with our #1 next year when we have many, many more needs on the team.

you *do* need to evaluate beck so that we know what we have going into next year's draft, but allowing him to play any more than the necessary time frame for evaluating his ability is not only redundant but harmful to miami's best interest. and as i have made clear, if you are calling for beck, you believe we know what we have in cleo after 4 games, and then by that logic we should know what we have in beck after 4 games.

[mal]

there is a lot of exuberance regarding this topic it seems, but i challenge anyone to read the entire following argument and provide a coherent and logical argument for starting beck in week 10.

the reasoning is this -- implicit in the call for beck is the assumption that we fully know what miami has in cleo lemon after four professional starts. rationality dictates that there is nothing special about lemon, so this should be a general rule for evaluating quarterbacks (and i think it is, four games is more than enough time to prove yourself). then, it also stands to reason that we will know if beck has the goods by letting him play the same time frame.

letting beck play any more than the time frame of which it is necessary to evaluate him is just stupid. clearly, we cannot win with cleo, and if beck performs better than cleo, he will obviously give us a better chance to win now. but winning now only hurts us as it pushes our draft position further back.

if we do poorly with beck in week 10, it will likely damage his confidence and hurt his prospects to becoming a better pro -- when was the last time you saw a rookie qb who was horrible their rookie year then went on to be good? then, we will need to draft a quarterback with our #1 next year when we have many, many more needs on the team.

you *do* need to evaluate beck so that we know what we have going into next year's draft, but allowing him to play any more than the necessary time frame for evaluating his ability is not only redundant but harmful to miami's best interest. and as i have made clear, if you are calling for beck, you believe we know what we have in cleo after 4 games, and then by that logic we should know what we have in beck after 4 games.

[Andy D]

LOL Alex, your probably right, I can see it now

"Now listen, Ive done a lot of thinking, and from my experience the best possible QB is a WR! Marty Booker is our new QB!"

The sad part is, this isnt too much of a stretch given some of the wacked out choices cam has made so far...

[bryan in ohio]

fire cam and mueller both are dopes!

[Gophins72]

A couple of points:

1. From everything we've seen so far Ginn appears to be an excellent Returner AND WR. Rookie WR's never make a full and immediate impact on an offense, Randy Moss being the glaring exception years ago. But Ginn has caught everything thrown his way and made better and more aggresive decisions in the return game from game to game. He's also been injury free. Plus, the Dolphins just traded away his competition at WR. So he's part of the solid young core of players that the Dolphins will be putting into this team over the next few seasons. He's a piece of an incomplete puzzle, this is a good thing. He's not a failure or anything close to it, so relax.

2. From everything we saw in the preseason Beck is going to be an excellent QB. Accurate, mobile, intelligent, etc. Cam and the Dolphins used a 2nd round choice on him and chose him over Quinn. This is Cam's guy, Cam wants to play him, wants to shut all of you fans up. So why in god's green earth is everyone so worried about when the Beck era actually begins, next game, 3 games from now, who cares? He's going to play this season and into the future;

3. This is the most important point of all: THE DOLPHINS ARE INTENTIONALLY TANKING THIS SEASON FOR THE FUTURE. This could not be any clearer, the Dolphins need to keep losing this season. They have to have one of the top 3 picks next draft (in each round). This has to happen and is one of the few things the Dolphins can still suceed at this Season.

4. Finally: Say what you want but the outline of the offense that is emerging this season looks very promising, Cam calls a very good game, play selection is excellent and the most important long term aspect of the offense, the offensive line, looks better and better each game (relative to last seasons mess). The talent is what's lacking. So view this season as one where an infrastructure is being put in place for future success by a totally different set of young players. For an example of where this could lead see Jimmy Johnson's 1st year with a horrible Cowboy's team and the development that occured each year thereafter.

[Ray]

The only complaint I have with Cleo Lemmon is that he doesn't have the accuracy and arm strength of John Beck. So no matter how many games he plays his arm is not going to get any better. Ginn was wide open against the Giants and the Cheatriots and Cleo simply could not get him the ball. Cleo has more escapability but who cares about that when you can't get the ball to your wideouts. The only thing Cam is deciding right now is whether or not he wants Beck to start against Buffalo, Philly and the Steelers on Monday Night Football or start against the Jets, Bills, and Ravens at home. I'm really ok with waiting until December to see Beck as long as we get the number one pick in the draft. I certainly don't want to win a handful of games just so we can pick 4th or 5th in the draft. We don't need to "see" anything about John Beck. He has the arm and the accuracy to be great in this league and Cam has the ability to make that happen. We all need to be patient.

[Truth Detector]

WTF, I can't beleive some of the nonsense I'm reading here. If Cam stays, we lose. Period. He's 18-45 lifetime as a head coach. Every time you start thinking he knows what he's doing because he has the job, all I want you to think is 18-45 lifetime and 0-8 lifetime in the NFL. And as Jerry Glanville said, the NFL stands for NOT FOR LONG if you can'w win.

[mike k]

Why can't the coach or owner make a cogent argument like Ray, Mal, Gophins, and others above rather than bumbling their way through this p.r. disaster. Don't say they are not showing their hand for competitive reasons, because that is intuitively dishonest and not in the team's interest regarding draft position--or they really are clueless. Giving them the benefit of the doubt, as we move forward, HAVE ANSWERS!! Be decisive and explain the intended course, or else let the internal investigation "Bobs" from Office Space wipe Cam and Co. out asafp!!

[Joshua]

My problem with waiting on Beck for a few more weeks is then it'll be December, and the teams the Fins play might be playing meaningless games, especially against the Jets, Bills, and Ravens. They'll be out of it, why bring full force? We need to see what Beck can do right now, especially when next year holds the promise of selecting a true franchise QB should Beck fail. Also, I love this hypocrisy of how Beck is the future, but not right now. If he's the future and has shown in practice to be capable, then why not go right now? The OLine seems to be coming along. Chatman can provide a decent component in the running game. The wideouts seem to be there. And for comparison's sake, Trent Edwards is younger and having a good season. And let's not forget that Ben Roethlisberger started his career in a hurricane against these very same Dolphins.

[dolfan abroad]

I suspect Beck will get limited playing time in the upcoming weeks. Like many QBs coming in, he will have to learn the hard way. With the rabid mood of the fan base right now, I sure hope he learns quick. Ted Ginn didnt get much of a grace period.

All in all, the team is getting better. We are still losing, but there are some positive signs. Watching New England violate the Skins puts that loss into perspective. Those guys are out to embarrass everyone who steps onto the field. The Colts better bring their A game.

[OC Dolphin]

SJ Bobkins:

I've been trying to make your very point countless times on this site. Enough with the Quinn talk! Quinn dropped like a led balloon for a reason - He is not that good! Did everyone notice how he held out during contract negotiations? He is a prima donna. He wanted top 5 $$.

I actually wonder what would have happened had Cleveland gone ahead and picked Quinn with their first pick. It would have meant that other teams needing a QB might have picked from the - so called, next tier group of QB's much earlier. It might have placed urgency for Miami to have picked Beck at the 9 spot instead of Ginn. But Quinn's falling afforded more leeway. Miami could get the QB they wanted all along AND pick another area of need.

We can debate ad-nauseam whether that should have been a receiver or someone like DT, Okoye who went to Houston at #10. Still I'm in full agreement with all who see Beck over Quinn.

[Gophins72]

A few more comments in reaction:

1. Bill Belichik was 36-44 as Head Coach of the Clevland Browns from 1991-1995. A horrible record no matter how you slice it up. So under Ray's analysis this man was a loser and always would be and should have never even been considered to Coach the Patriots? Winning is learned in the NFL and it takes time to rebuild any team as decimated as the Dolphins have been by the previous shepards of this team.

2. Cam can't say it any differently, he can't get up there and say "hey, look we're tanking this season, we don't want to win even a few games this season. In fact we've got a really talented young QB on the sidelines who we don't dare risk playing to soon into this season for fear that in his youthful exuburence he might win a few too many games for us this season". So he hems and haws and literally takes one for the team. But actions speak louder than words and that's why average Lemon starts, Chambers leaves town, Green is put to pasture for the rest of the season and Zach Thomas suddenly has "whiplash". At least we're not watching anymore as kick returners line up at the 35 yard line and proceed to watch kick-off sail over their heads while our overly hairy coach impersonates a scared bird, flapping his wings on the sideline.

[Armando]

Depth chart is head coach's responsability, if Cam can not make the right decision then Huizenga should look for another coach but owner must delegate team's responsibilities to the head coach.

[OC Dolphin]

Greg:

Huizenga does not strike me as the kind of guy who mandates, or instructs his underlings on what to do. He could however make his desires very, very clear by issuing a press release announcing that the stadium's concessions will stop selling lemonade and start carrying Beck's beer.

[G-Train]

Huizenga is a moron. Expecting or hoping he will do anything to help the Dolphins is delusional.

[Tom]

Mad fans = no attendance = no moolah.

Dump Cam and get the fans back on your side Wayne. The boohooers who are crying for Cam on this site do not represent your fanbase. You want to see what everyone really thinks about the idiot who coaches your team, go take the coach approval ratings at ESPS:

http://proxy.espn.go.com/nfl/sportsnation/ratings

The current approval rating for our knucklehead coach is 21%. Save the franchise Wayne - send Cam packing before the Buffalo game.

[Tom]

Hey Gophins72

If Cam were "rebuilding" everyone would give him a chance. So let's explore how Cam defines "rebuilding". He rebuilds by spending $20 million on an old and injured LB. He rebuilds by giving away a 4th round draft pick for a 37 year old QB with a history of concussions. He rebuilds by drafting a punt returner with the 9th overall pick in the draft. Do I really need to go on? The point is Cam NEVER pursued this as a rebuilding job and because of that incompetence he has set us back even further.

Fire Cam now!!!

[Colonel Kurtz]

THE HORROR, THE HORROR..

[Andy D]

lol hilarious post OC agreed with all of it!

[tiell]

FIRE CAM - HIRE BILL COWHER!!!!

[Andy D]

Now Tom, watch out with the punt returner stuff. You know ive come around on my boy Ginn, as a rookie WR I see some sparks.. not sold 100%, but he isnt close to a bust yet... that being said, the trent green trade and porter signing were two of the worst mistakes ive seen, and although im sure green is all cams doing, porter could well be all muellers. or capers. who knows?

Lets see Beck, and Tom lets not be harsh on him now. I hate Cam as much as you, and Cam will probably be long gone while Beck is still with us - I have confidence in the kid, got to. You think were drafting a QB next year? NOT A CHANCE IN HELL. So go Beck!!!!!!!

[Don Shula's neighbor]

I really believe Wayne Huiznega should not step in and demand Beck. This would be a disaster because you would be forcing a decision upon the coach.

Instead, I would sit back and let Cam Cameron do what he feels he wants to do. Then, if I felt it was a wrong move, I would evaluate the situation at the end of the season.

We all (well except for Cameron) know and feel Beck should start after the bye week for the sake of our future, but if Cameron opts not to play him after the bye, then it gives Huizenga yet one more motive to fire Cameron at the end of the season. You let the coach coach and then you drop the axe.

[r.duke]

I agree with those who think minimally HC, DC, GM, assistant coaches(with exception of Houck(sp?)and entire scouting personnel should be dumped about a 100 miles off shore into the Atlantic without so much as a floatation device, sunscreen or Dramamine. Does anyone actually believe our team could be any worse for the wear by hiring a GM that is known to have a brain and let him put coaching staff, scouting staff etc in place? This is the worst Dolphin team ever. EVER. The bitter irony is that guys like Wanny and Spielman are probably thinking "They were never that bad while we were there." True they were in process of deconstruction at that time. Now that the team has been fully deconstructed it's time to finish the job and jetison coaching staff save Houck. Also Wayne why do you want to hang onto a team that just continues to sink to new lows. Aren't you tired of failure? After London debacle I'd think you would want to sell the team and try your hand at something else like owning a chain of Bingo Halls and Bowling Alley's. Just think about it. I bet those enterprises would make you a fortune without all the humiliation and you could catch all the Dolphin games in the comfort of your own home or a sports bar.

[Tom]

Andy D

I'm not ragging on Ginn as much as I am the lunacy of drafting a punt returner with the 9th overall pick. Ginn may, or may not, turn into a productive player. Right now the verdict is still out on him. 7 catches for the season and mediocre return statistics do not inspire much confidence so far. But who knows, he may be good. I did like the catch on Sunday and the week before he was wide open down the middle for a TD but our Lemon overthrew him. For our sake I hope Ginn turns into an all-pro, because whether we like it or not, he's ours.

As for Beck, I'm rooting for him 100%. But at this point, no one can even render a good guess as to whether he'll pan out. Bottom line is Cam seems very reluctant to play him. What do you think that means?

[lJorge luis]

fish eye proves that there are some fan who are dumber than the fins management.. qb is not the problem? what the hell? that has been our problem since Marino left. Let the man coach his team? he has cost HIS team four winnable games with his bone head play calling Build an offense line? uh, I think thats Hudson Houck's doing. ness yo Shuler, Shuler was never going to make it in the league regardless. Either a player can play or he cant. Either a coach can coach or he cant. Cam is a good assisant.. just like wannsedt and Turner. I will say this again, bring in Marty and demote CaMoron to off. assitant.. they u will get results.

[r.duke]

I really do wish Pioli would take on the IMMENSE CHALLENGE of rebuilding the Dolphins with enough cash thrown at him. Problem is I don't think one billion dollars would be enough. But Wayne you don't have anything to lose by trying. Just make sure he actually wants the job once the dollar signs in his eyes have faded. I wouldn't be so concerned about Cam-Mueller if we didn't suck so bad and I actually had faith in them to draft wisely but I don't. And given our likely position in draft it would be excellent opportunity to upgrade our talent. Unfortuneately I think they'll stink up the joint, have Dolphin fans BOOOOOOOOOOOOING and other teams fans laughing until they choke due to another year of poor to questionable draft decisions and ridiculous FA signings.

[dan marino]

HEY EVERYBODY, ITS ME DAN, IM GONNA PUT IT TO REST AND MAKE A CALL TO CAM IN THE MORNING. HE WILL START BECK , TRUST ME! NOW , IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE I CAN DO FOR YALL FANS I LOVE SO MUCH.

[ginrai]

Cam deserves the benefit of the doubt. He's only has been here half a season. He also had to deal with alot of injuries this year. Both offensively and defensively. No one can't win having that many of their players banged up. To win you need the horses no matter how good of a coach.

[r.duke]

Oh yeah I forgot what this blog was all about. Definitely find out what Beck brings to the table and start him next game. Dumb down the offense if need be. Jesus that sounds like an oxymoron. I think it's fairly clear where Cleo stands as far as being starting QB material.

[r.duke]

ginrai I say keep Cam but only if Pioli or Parcells is GM. I wonder if Parcells would give Cam benefit of the doubt?

[Horatio Alger]

Where is Bobby Beathard in this discussion of GM's? Does he still work for Lightning Bolts? Is he retired? Is he washed up? He obviously has had a good eye for talent.

[Don]

Cameron is a loser!!!! Hire Parcells as GM and let him run the show. I am sure the first move he makes is to fire this moron.

[Dolfanaddict]

Dan Marino thanks for the help. Now please take Tom Brady out drinking and slip him a roofie or two. Once he's out cold put him behind the wheel of his Hummer and push it over a cliff. Thanks Dan. Your still the MAN in my book.

[NCFINFAN13]

Ginn, 7 catches, 20.1 yard average. ZERO (0) drops!!!!! With limited playing time.

24 yard KR average.(Oh & broke one that was called back).

Not a bad decision IMO.

[ginrai]

I don't like NewEngland but it's wrong to wish a tragedy of that kind to anyone including Patroits Qb Brady. How would you feel if that was you?

[Javier]

I didn't know and I speak for a lot of fans that miami will get the number one draft pick next year if we don't play beck or if we do play beck he has to do a bad job to get the number one draft pick. I say lets be smart about this one, keep playing cleo and lets get that number ONE PICK next year. Then lets play beck and get this thing turned around in a hurry. BOOM go doplhins. #1 pick f**k those other teams up!!!!

[Dolfanaddict]

ginrai you sound like you have a good heart but it was only a joke. Sick? Unquestionably sick and twisted but definitely not serious.

[Javier]

Sorry for bashing you cam I didn't know number one pick was at risk.

[Mike Hunt]

Javier your plan is sound with exception of Dolphins need to know ASAP if Beck is starting QB material.

[OC Dolphin]

Tom:

I read your remarks answering Gophins72. Let me pipe in on this one. First, you've got to remember that during the off-season, not one analyst, fan, coach, owner could have imagined that our defense would suddenly drop from being one of the top five D's in the league down to the very bottom. Porter's signing was thought as an assurance that the level would be maintained. Clearly, the D's demise is more than one player deep.

Secondly. Few would argue that we needed experienced hands at the helm quarterbacking this weakened offense. No rookie QB would do here. The team needed an experienced, successful QB. Personally I would have gone after Garcia, but obviously Cam had player-coach experience with Green. Something that has value. The fact that Green did a bonehead thing by using his bonehead on a block should not be held against a coach. Beyond all this and in-spite of it all, a 4th round pick alone is worth savvy tutelage applied on your future QB.

Lastly. You really should stop referring to the 9th pick as picking up a punt returner. It paints you as an angry and tunnel-visioned. Look back at what draft boards listed before the draft. Ginn was listed in many of them as the #2 WIDE RECEIVER behind the "could-not-miss" #1 receiver - Calvin Johnson. For a team that analysts openly listed as needing help at wide receiving Ginn, who also returned punts very well in college was an added BONUS. The group of WR's were thin. So thin that KC who also needed help in that position had to settle for Dwayne Bowe (who) as their 23rd pick. Would you be as much a doubting Thomas were Beck picked at the 9 spot and Ginn at the 40? Well, guess what? Ginn would not have lasted past the 23rd. Certainly not untill #40 and we would have had to sellect someone like Sidney Rice or slow Dwayne Jarrett.

I've posted reasons why Beck (who Miami really wanted, and please, enough with the Quinn talk) was not their ideal #9 pick. The board had lots of 2nd tier QB's and they picked the best WIDE RECEIVER available at #9.

Keep one thing in mind my friend. Two years from now, if Ginn and Beck are proven winners, no one will give a rats ass who was selected first or second. Only that we draft 07 was a success.

[ginrai]

Be more careful what you say the next time cause it sounds life threatening, making it sound serious instead of joke. Even though you didn't meant it that way.

[Joel]

You cam fans are a bunch of idiot fags. I read someone said in this blog that ginn wasnt a bad pick up, that he runs well and catches everything.... HE RUNS BACKWARDS ON PUNTS! Hes anoth idiot! What a great 9th pick huh? How can anyone say cam was right about picking him up for his 9th pick? Fire this idiot Cam. Hes clueless and dumb. His coaching career isnt a mistake, it tells it all.

[Tom]

OC, I wrote a long reply, but erased most of it. It got so longwinded it started approaching Flippers normal Bible length posts.

Bottom line is we do not agree. I see egregious errors in just about everything Cam_Mueller have done. You don't. I guess time will tell.

On one thing we do agree. I am angry and I wish more of our fans were angry. I'm angry at what these idiots have done to OUR team. It's not theirs, it's ours. I have a lifetime invested in the Dolphins and I can't believe what has come of our team. I'm absolutely outraged at the level of incompetence that has resulted in the best franchise in football being turned into the laughing stock of the league.

We're a bad joke OC and all I see is the joke getting worse and worse and worse as long as we have the knuckleheaded duo, Cam_Mueller, running the show.

[james]

Don't you all think it's better for Cam to let the Bills gameplan against Cleo vs. an unknown in Beck for the next week and a half?

[Fins Fan to the Grave]

FIRE DAVE WANDSTAT! BENCH FIELDER! START LUCAS! START GRIESE! FIRE NICK SABAN! BENCH CULPEPPER! (SHOULD'VE KEPT CULPEPPER!) FIRE CAM CAMERON! SELL THE TEAM!

To those of you who take the time to type this garbage: please...pretty please find another football team and another message board to pollute.

[OC Dolphin]

Tom, there is no such person as Cam_Mueller. There is Cam Cameron and Randy Mueller, but last I saw, they did not step into Star Trek's transporter room and suddenly merge as one entity up in Broward Co.

Randy Muelller has had a poor showing thus far. He stunk up the place with Saban, allowing him to run roughshod with his role in player selection. This year with Cameron it still remains to be seen. Some picks made sense, but we won't know the full result for at least two years. I do think that we can improve in this area though.

The noble and genuine POV that somehow this is our team - poppycock! We don't make player decisions. We don't call the plays. We don't get asked diddli squat for any such advise. We don't pay the electricity bills, the uniforms. The view that somehow owners owe us anything is pure hogwash. We can feel let down. Even betrayed. But make no mistake - WH, or any other owner for that matter is ever going to ask any collective voice for advise on what to do. This is not a political party asking its constituency what to do about taxes. It's a business run by a bunch of wealthy people.

[bryan in ohio]

fire cam he is worse then wanny get rid of mueller too.

[Lou Vales]

Greg, It just dawned on me that this might be a Justice Department matter. Maybe someone in the Dolphin organization has decided he or she(LOL) doesn't like Mormons. Maybe he or she got mad at Mitt Romney over a statement, maybe he or she had a bad time in Provo----I don't know the answer, but what other possible explanation for sitting a 26!!!! year old rookie in the midst of a potential 0-16 season???

Now Beck has already been in a missionairy position which was probably tougher than anything he would face in the NFL. The kid---I'm sorry I Forgot!!!---is barely younger than Bernie Kosar and NOW may be the time for him to get some experience. If not, Beck can only look for the equivalent of a latter day Bobby Kennedy and seek some justice.

I understand that some people may not be comfortable voting for a Mormon--Not Me--to lead the Free World, but to not lead the Dolphins would be a stretch.

[Dolphan]

Take it easy ... you should have faith in Cam, can you see play actual miami offense?, can you see the performance of Ronnie Brown or the offense line? this is an outstanding offense, much better than the 3 or 4 past years miami offense, and this is work of Cam.

He knows when the Beck time will come, may next game, may in 4 games, just Cam knows that and watching his outstanding job in miami offense I still have have faith in Cam.

[Orren Hatch]

Joseph Smith has a better chance of playing for Cameron than Beck.

[Patriots Fan 19-0]

Fins Fans to the Grave, I think it was Satan who fired the Fins.

[NCFINFAN69]

He'll start Beck.He's just wanting it to look like his decision and not like he's giving into fan/media pressure.

[NCFINFAN69]

He'll start Beck.He's just wanting it to look like his decision and not like he's giving into fan/media pressure.

[John]

I am not one to make predictions, but I will now go out on a limb, the only thing I ask, is that you remember , you heard it here and now.
Beck will FAIL, Cameron knows it, that is why he is reluctant to start him, that is why Wayne is not pushing the matter. He is not NFL starting material, what the Dolphins did was draft another backup, just wait you'll see!!!!!!!!!

[Tom]

OC my good, but slightly misguided friend, we may not own the team, but it's still OURS. It's the Miami Dolphins good friend, not the Huizenga Hens (or whatever). Miami - that's us even if we're not there now. It's not like one of those company baseball teams from back in the early 1900s. This team carries the city name making it figuratively ours. WH is just a caretaker. As to who makes decisions, you're right, but watch us twist his arm until he gives. I want you to watch for all those empty seat next Sunday (at least half empty). That will be you and me (maybe more me than you) and a lot of our fellow Dolfans dictating to WH that he needs to do something about fixing OUR team.

Ginn was a bad pick because we had the 9th overall pick in the draft and Ginn was not a 9th pick talent. Based on the draft experts he was closer to a 20th pick talent. In addition to that, he was not a need talent. We already had Welker. So beyond the fact that he is really a specialist (kick returner), Ginn was just a plain old fashioned crappy draft pick and I said that before he ever played a down. Now that I've seen him play, I've changed my mind - he was a shitty draft pick.

[Tom]

So our offense is getting better? Our overall offensive rank this year is 18th (323 yds/gm). Last year it was 20th (310 yds/gm). BFD. Doesn't look like much of an improvement to me from the supposed "offensive genius", Cam Cameron.

But look what he has done to our defense. Last year we ranked 4th overall (289 yds/gm). This year we are now 24th overall (349 yds/gm). Capers is culpable as well, but it is Cam's team so he must bear some of the responsibility for our defensive downfall.

So here is what we really have with Cam. No real improvement on offense and a dramatic defensive decline.

[eric wendelken]

WAYNE SUCKS, start beck and lets see what this kid has. hes 26, i dont think we have to worry about his feelings getting hurt if he plays bad.

[Noel]

Most of the offensive improvement is garbage yards and points at the end of blowouts. Experience is the best teacher. Put Beck in now! He should have been in long ago.

[Tom]

Noel is 100% correct. Let's see if Beck is the answer or whether we have to go back to the QB market next year because of another wasted 2nd rounder on an unproductive QB.

[One True Blue Dolfan]

But as Cam said Cleo gives us the best chance of winning. If we run the table we'll be 0-7 or is it 0-8?(I've lost track at the number of loses). We could possibly almost get at 500. Cam will be coach of the year and Wayne will be owner of the year. Just you wait and see. With Cleo at QB and Worrel and safety we can't be stopped and no one can score on us. Listen to Cam. Cam knows what he's doing. He's the man with a plan and he knows football. So all you Wayne-Cam-Mueller-assistant coaches-scouting personnel haters can just go find yourself another team because you are not true fans. True fans will love Wayne-Cam-Mueller-Scoutng-etc more than they love their own mothers and fathers for Christ sake. Mom and Dad will soon be in the ground but THE DOLPHINS LIVE FOREVER!!!!!!

[OC Dolphin]

Tom, you need to check that short-term memory with your doctor. You should remember the draft condition that existed back leading to April 28th. There, listed for all to see were each team's need. Miami was listed as needing a QB, WR, OL, DL.

Do me a favor. Google "nfl draft 2007." When you see the Wikipedia link, go ahead and hit it. Next, scroll down to where it says: Miami Dolphins. What do you read to the right? Does it say "punt returner?"

As I've stated above and countless other times. Miami needed to draft a QB, WR, OL, and DL. They did all that! The area which was slim pickings at the #9 position was WR!!!!!!!!!

You can argue with me the merits of picking Meachem over Ginn. I'll give you that. But Picking a WR at #9 was correct.

Our next pick was the #40 as you well know. Had we picked a DL or OL, we would have no-doubt picked up Beck (if he was still around at #40), which meant picking a WR at #60.

Not too many quality WR's to select from at that point.

[Tom]

OC

Come on now, because Wikipedia describes Ginn as a WR that means something? Oh my goodness. I know we're both approaching that age where memory can do funny things, but I think it is your memory that has gone haywire here my friend. So here is the direct quote from Cam talking up his first draft pick ever right after making the pick:

“I’ve known this young man for over 10 years. I’ve watched this young man for a long time. You will be thrilled every time you watch him as a punt returner.”

NOT WR, but a PUNT RETURNER. That is what Cam said, not me OC. Sorry, but Ginn is first and foremost a PUNT RETURNER and a WR secondarily.

Even his own teammates see him as a punt returner. Here’s a quote from Vonnie Holliday.

“With the ninth pick they took a guy who is basically a kick returner. … Maybe he’ll come in eventually and become a better route-runner and make some plays. But I couldn’t believe it then, and I can’t believe it now.”

I'm with Vonnie. I still can't beleive the pick. And I'm amazed you're defending it.

Though we needed a WR, we had no business drafting a quasi-WR at #9 when the talent was not there to support being taken at that position. There were several other players at need positions that were rated much higher than Ginn. Those include DL Okoye and Carricker, DB Revis and Griffin, and QB Quinn.

[Tom]

One more thing. If none of those picks worked for Cam_Mueller, they should have traded out of the spot. They could have picked up a WR later in the draft when the spot fit the talent. Sorry OC, you just don't waste a #9 on a #25 talent. And that wasted pick really hurt our overall draft which according to experts was not very good. The consensus grade on our 2007 draft is a 1.9 out of 4.0 at ESPN.

[OC Dolphin]

Tom:

Let me guess, one of your favorite albums is "Thick as a Brick" by Pink Floyd.

You just can't handle the truth!

[CJ]

tom espn worthless and bias. i wouldnt put to much of your stock in ESPN

[OC Dolphin]

As a freshman, Ginn saw moderate playing time and finished the 2004 season with 25 receptions for 359 yards and 2 touchdowns.

Ginn earned a spot as the Buckeyes Starting receiver his sophomore year in 2005. He finished the season with 51 receptions for 803 yards and four touchdowns.

Entering the 2006 season, Ginn was considered by many to be a preseason candidate for the Heisman Trophy and the Biletnikoff Award. He was a second team All-American selection and finished as the Buckeyes top receiver with 59 catches for 781 yards.

Ginn finished his career at Ohio State with 125 receptions for 1,943 yards and 15 touchdowns in 37 games.

Yep Tom, you are absolutely correct my friend. Ginn is not. I repeat, NOT a wide receiver.

Hardy-har-har!

[r.duke]

OC apparently you are pretty comfortable with the way last years draft went. I agree I have a better feeling about Beck than Quinn. As far as Beck's age didn't Roger Staubach start his NFL career around same age 26 or 27 years of age due to his committment to Naval Academy and he had a fine career. Ginn who knows. Too early to tell. I do like Satele. I liked idea of monster fullback they picked up Mauria(?) can't think of his name but I don't know if he's been injured simply or unproductive to this point or what. I can't think of DL we picked up or if he has shown much to date. Booker I have serious doubts about this pick. A rookie runningback not getting playing time doesn't look promising. Porter just seems like a dreadful pick and huge wasted finacial investment. Very Stupid Move. Mental mistakes by the entire team all season, constantly shooting themselves in foot does not reinforce my confidence in Cam at all. OK they have had injuries 6-10 years of HORRIFIC drafts and dreadful FA acquistions but that is no excuse for undisciplined play. Cam's statements do make you wonder what the hell the line of thinking is here. I'm not so sure he is slyly out manuvering anyone. I think he's in over his head. I obviously could be wrong. I just don't believe in our HC or GM. We are like a bad highschool team compared to NFL's better teams. We are like a Pee Wee football team compared to the Patriots. I'm sick to death of Wayne's excuses, people making excuses for Wayne. If he doesn't know how to play the game of football he needs someone who actually does and hire him to oversee football operations. I'm talking Polian, PIOLI(ideally but that's a pipedream), perhaps Parcells. Someone with a real track record of significantly improving NFL franchises. If these types of knowledgeable football people are actually committed to seeing Dolphins rebuilding process through and they're comfortable with current HC I'd give them benefit of the doubt without hesitation. I have a feeling they might just ditch Cam in favor of someone they actually have confidence in. Sorry Zulu for speaking my mind. You're right I'm not by any stretch of the imagination a professional football analyst. I just look around league and notice who has history of success and wish Miami had these successful people. Why because when is the last time we we're successful? REALLY SUCCESSFUL. Not just competitive or entertaining though many would settle for that at this point. When was the last time we actually had a complete team? When was the last time you actually believed Miami was more balanced and talented than it's divisional rivals and actually went out and proved it and had you ecstatically high-fiving fellow Dolphin fans. This answer is simple and will piss alot of you off but it was when they they beat the stuffing out of the Vikings in 1974. 33 YEARS AGO. Anyway OC where do you stand on Wayne Cam and Mueller at this point? I'm not being critical of your feedback. I do respect your takes.

[OC Dolphin]

Tom:

Here's yet another of what the many quote "experts" had opined back in April. Please take a look in particular to who was the 2nd overall WR. That's Wide Receiver. As in - a football player, who catches passes from the QB.

www.huddlegeeks.com/NFL_Draft/mockdraft.htm

(Ted Ginn, 2nd receiver slated to be picked by the Rams)

I can see why Tony sometimes gets so frustrated with you. You tend not to openly view facts.

[Tom]

OC

Ok, maybe I am thick as a brick and I do like the song, but let me introduce you to the mirror.

So, success in college against the likes of Bowling Green, Akron, Northwestern, etc, means your a player? Hmm? Now you don't really subscribe to that do you?

In any event, what I wrote to you about Ginn was not from me, it was directly from his own head coach and teammate. THEY DESCRIBE HIM AS A PUNT RETURNER. He was not, and is not, primarily a WR. He may be playing at WR now, but only because we let two better players get away, Chambers and Welker.

But now that Ginn is ours, I do hope he proves to be a real WR. His return skills are not anywhere near what Cam promised. In the future (which hopefully will begin next Sunday), I hope that Beck to Ginn becomes as familiar to us a Marino to Duper and Clayton. How great will that be?

I must say OC, your comments lately lead me to believe that smoke inhalation may have caused some brain damage. You should see a specialist. I suggest Andy D, Noel or rduke. They can probably help.

[Tom]

OC

I don't care if he was the 2nd ranked WR and neither should you. What you should consider is was his talent deserving of being the 9th overall pick. That's it. He didn't have that talent level according to EVERY expert in the country outside of Cam and Mueller.

This is the same logic you used in telling me why drafting Quinn at #9 was not a good thing. You suggested he wasn't that good. You said this in spite of the overwhelming consensus of experts who disagreed with your position. I'm just saying the same thing about Ginn, except I have the experts on my side. That's all.

Now don't get all fired up here. This is just a friendly debate not a war. In the end we are all Dolfans looking for the same thing - A RING!!!

[Andy D]

Tom

You should know by now that cam isnt even aware he is a head football coach. I wouldnt take any of his decisions seriously.

[Tom]

Andy D

Thanks for lightening this up.

To CJ

You may be right about ESPN, but I can cite you a number of other draft rating serices and not a single one had a consensus (average) rating that was above a "C". None!

[Andy D]

And OC, Dwayne Bowe is doing about 1000x better then Ginn right now. Bad example lol

[sicoloosing]

OK, let's see, start a rookie, with a mediocre offensive line, with the worse set of receivers in the league, with the only star in the team and best offensive weapon out for the season while the team is 0-8, and if the kid cannot perform to Dan Marino standards go out and draft another quarterback with the first pick....pleeeease!

[OC Dolphin]

r.duke:

All very good points. And I do share many of your concerns and views. You've got a lot there to respond to, so let me see if I can find some creative way of Cliff Noting the response.

1. JC, Buddha, Mohammed could have fit roles of owner, GM, and coach and this 2007 Dolphin version would be 1 or 2 games better. That's some talent at the helm, that's not much of a difference in terms of hypothetical games won. No one can gas up an Edsel and make it fly around the moon.

2. Mueller may have some talent at picking players, or it could be Cam. Not being an "insider" I would not be so bold as to ID the party responsible for what I believe will be one of the best drafts this team has pulled off in quite some time. Mueller's inability to have impact during Saban's tenure suggests that Cam may have more to do with it that the reverse. I have no problem, and would reasonably expect for WH to burn a sacrificial offering by getting rid of Mueller at the end of the season. I don't expect to see WH firing Cameron though. Moreover, since I expect this very team to win about 3 games from here on out.

3. Excuse me if this sounds a bit too "professorial," but we live in an age where change, and perhaps more importantly, the desire for change is demanded at the speed of thought. Having patience for anything today is increasingly difficult. We are way too ready to dump everything when the first sign of difficulty shows up.

Hope that answers some of it. Long and short of it is that I would hope that there is enough patience demonstrated by all parties concerned - i.e., ownership, coaches, players, fans, to allow for success to happen. Things of this nature do not happen overnight.

[gtd]

The Dolphins have absolutely nothing to gain in leaving Beck on the bench.

Yes, he might get hit. But a lot of young QBs learned their position taking tons of hits.

There is no time like the present when expectations are low.

[OC Dolphin]

Tom:

"He didn't have that talent level according to EVERY expert in the country outside of Cam and Mueller." That's pure fabrication in your part. Did Cam and Mueller place Ginn as the second receiver being picked in the draft as shown in the link below?

www.huddlegeeks.com/NFL_Draft/mockdraft.htm

Well, I guess they did, cause you said so!

[Tom]

OC

I didn't make anything up. I'm not saying that Ginn was not the 2nd best WR in the country, though some experts disagree on that point. What I am saying is that Ginn was not the 9th best player, or even the 10th or 11th and at the 9th spot we should have drafted a talent that better represented the spot in which we were drafting.

That's all. Here are a couple of ranking sites. I picked them by googling "ranking the 2007 nfl draft". Not a single one has Ginn ranked higher than the 24th best prospect. I took a look at the huddlegeeks site but they did not have similar feature. Go take a look yourself and if you still think we got value at the 9th pick, well then we'll just have to agree to disagree.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/6421386

http://profootballexperts.scout.com/a.z?s=211&p=9&c=12&nid=83&lnid=124&yr=2007

http://www.footballsfuture.com/2007/prospects/